Are we becoming hated? :/

[SilverMaple]

I've noticed a lot of people saying that yaoi novels and yaoi mangas are all the same, and most are crap as they all involve girly men and smut. Yaoi is becoming one of the stereotypical cliches in novels and manga, apparently, like fantasy, farmboys-turned-heroes, and Mary Sues.

I respond with, "But... But I LOVE writing and drawing yaoi and shounen-ai stories! I don't want to do other stuff!" gonk

I generally have low self-esteem when it comes to my work so now I'm afraid people will shoot me down just for having yaoi, which automatically makes me "mainstream". sad But what if I don't care? What if I love a yaoi story, even if it is considered cliche? Is it bad to write a story like that? Besides, it's hard to make something completely original nowadays...

This is not about homophobia, but how yaoi writers and artists like myself are starting to get the bashing that Mary-Sue writers or Eragon-like writers are getting (No offense to any Eragon fans. I've never read the books, but has anyone noticed how many people hate them?).

crying I'm sad...  

[Super Cy]

it's okay, i get the same thing for my doodles and stories. really most of the people who bash it are homophobes or have never picked up a yaoi in there life, in which case they have no idea what there talking about. there are diff. ideas out there for yaoi, but there are only so many plot lines. If you like what you do and are satisfied with it, than do it. don't let anyone get you down. Besides what you draw could someday end up in and AMV or something along those lines! That may not seem all that great, but it would be obvious there are people out there who like it! I'm not much help am I? ninja  

[For-Chan Cookie]

SilverMaple

I've noticed a lot of people saying that yaoi novels and yaoi mangas are all the same, and most are crap as they all involve girly men and smut. Yaoi is becoming one of the stereotypical cliches in novels and manga, apparently, like fantasy, farmboys-turned-heroes, and Mary Sues.

They're right. I love yaoi and all but they are so right! There is a lot of stereotypical trash out there. I read one yaoi novel and was completely turned off by how horrible it was. Characterization sucked. The premise was just silly. *sighs* A lot of yaoi is like that these days. There's a lot of crap out there that's not worth printing let alone buying. Because of what's on offer, people read that and think that's how yaoi should be, so then they write that kind of flat lifeless stuff and more people read it and create more. It's a vicious cycle of crap!

Not all yaoi is crap. There's some really nice stuff out there as well, but for every good piece of yaoi, there's a dozen more sucky ones. When it comes to fanfiction in general, not just yaoi fanfics, but all fanfics, most of it is crap. This is not reserved to just yaoi, it's just that most fanfiction is not that great. People don't want to admit that when they say yaoi fanfiction is crap, but it's an all over problem.

The same goes for fanart. Not all of it is good. I know artists try really hard, but trying does not always mean succeeding. Some art out there is painful to look at. The fact that most yaoi fangirls want to draw bishonen that look like girls, all slender and girly faced with long hair and big sparkly eyes does not help our cause.

That brings me to another point, for a lot of girls, yaoi is the new het. They force one character into the uke role and basically make them the "girl" of the relationship. They don't look at this as a gay relationship, or even a relationship with two perfectly capable males, they really do force the uke to be a chick with a d**k. They're weepy and hormonal and out of character and it's just awful. It's something else that perpetuates the stereotype of yaoi being full of junk.

In order to get away from such a reputation, people need to stop squeeing over the bad s**t. Seriously! Just because there's two supposed boys in a story, doesn't mean it's any good! People need to shut up about subpar works and demand quality. People need to produce quality. People need to get away from these outdated stereotypes and get adventurous. If that happened, some of those critics out there would shut up. But until then, yaoi is going to get a bad rap.  

[SilverMaple]

Thank you, Super_Cy, you have made me feel better. 3nodding

And For-Chan Cookie, I agree with what you said. I do try to make my male characters more believable and not girls with penises, which I agree, is annoying. I have read many a slash fanfiction that just turned me off instantly. It's not just about the boy love, it's also about the plot, the grammar, the overall feeling the work gives. I do want to produce quality yaoi work! >_<  

[.husbife]

[ Stop caring about what other people think.]

[ problem=solved.] xd


[ *continues browsing for BL pics*]  

[Death By Squirrel]

Ohyes.

We always have been.

<3

Liking yaoi/shounen-ai hardly makes me "mainstream" where I lived, trust me. *Nodnod*

 

[Haku-sensei]

im a yaoi writter, artist, reader, and filmer, i get the same crappy comments, but you know what, no matter what people say, i enjoy what i do, especially times when i get paid for it lol. so i dont give a crap if someones wants to call me a loser because i do what everyone else does, besides, if you add your own twist to it, which im sure you do, your not really "mainstream" then are you? well, i may have babbled a bit but i hoped that helped.  

[Ootori Kyouya-sama]

O whole heartedly agree with For-Chan Cookie. The problem is that fangirls are squeeing over mediocre work and companies are learning that crap sells better than art--and it's usually cheaper too. Everyone is to blame.  

[milkymosaic]

Then just ignore them! blaugh Who the hell cares what they say? Certianly not me. I mean, if you're putting me down, am I really gonna feel like listening to you? Seriously? So just do what you like to do and don't worry. There's still plenty of perfectly good yaoi material out there that has not been tained by cliches.  

[SilverMaple]

Nanar

Then just ignore them! blaugh Who the hell cares what they say? Certianly not me. I mean, if you're putting me down, am I really gonna feel like listening to you? Seriously? So just do what you like to do and don't worry. There's still plenty of perfectly good yaoi material out there that has not been tained by cliches.

Exactly. It's like vampires; there have been so many badly written vampire books and Anne Rice wannabes that now people expect anything with vampires in it to be crap. You just gotta look harder. 3nodding  

[For-Chan Cookie]

SilverMaple

Exactly. It's like vampires; there have been so many badly written vampire books and Anne Rice wannabes that now people expect anything with vampires in it to be crap. You just gotta look harder. 3nodding

Hell, who'd want to be Anne Rice these days? She's gone over the edge. Her quality of work has fallen. She no longer uses an editor of any kind. People hated her last book and attempted to send it back to her in the mail. She freaked out all over the amazon review boards, typing up a fierce diatribe against her dissenters of her work. Oh yeah, she's writing a book on Jesus. Anne Rice has reverted to the level of every 13 year old fangirl you've ever known. I think anyone can do a better job with vampires these days, even a 13 year old fangirl.  

[LadyNox]

The minute someone writes something and publishes it (whether it's on the internet or as a book) it will have critics. People will either love it so much they can't breathe or they'll hate it so much they can't stop complaining about it. As that piece of writing increases in popularity, so will the reactions to it. The people who love it and the people who hate it will meet, and if these people lack maturity (which will more than likely happen, especially when the fandoms are full of 13 year old girls and boys), there will be flame wars. Insults and uncalled for remarks will fly from both sides, and us innocent bystanders have to put up with that kind of garbage.

This is normal. This will always happen. Whether we're talking about a piece of yaoi or an article written in a prestigious psychological journal. So you can stop writing yaoi because people say it's mainstream (which it's not, that's ridiculous) crap and go to another fandom and you'll find a lot of the same thing there, down to the cliche story lines and the whiny fans. Or you can do whatever you want, because honestly this is the internet after all. Who cares?  

[Sheard]

For-Chan Cookie

The same goes for fanart. Not all of it is good. I know artists try really hard, but trying does not always mean succeeding. Some art out there is painful to look at. The fact that most yaoi fangirls want to draw bishonen that look like girls, all slender and girly faced with long hair and big sparkly eyes does not help our cause.

That brings me to another point, for a lot of girls, yaoi is the new het. They force one character into the uke role and basically make them the "girl" of the relationship. They don't look at this as a gay relationship, or even a relationship with two perfectly capable males, they really do force the uke to be a chick with a d**k. They're weepy and hormonal and out of character and it's just awful. It's something else that perpetuates the stereotype of yaoi being full of junk.

I don't have a problem with the bishonen-style boys when it is artistic style and not being done deliberately. You cannot really be a fan of some artists and be opposed to it. Clamp comes to mind a lot here but then all their characters (both straight and gay) tend to be pretty and overly slender, but their male characters are all still very clearly male. The only series I've liked where the guys look like girls is Five Star Stories, but FFS is mecha (not yaoi) with all the guys looking girls and the actual girls are all robots.

The problem is fan girls (and certain professional artists) who take things too far and are clearly not drawing with a consistent artistic style. So you end up with most males looking clearly male... except the one uke who is forced to look like a girl and act like a girl. It detracts so much that it would have ended up being much better if they had just made the character an actual girl.  

[Montypythoniisss]

Wow.......I'd never noticed any of this before. But it's true.  

[Scythe Shadrak]

We are not becoming hated.
Rapid 12-years old horny fangirls are. The only problem is that they are giving us bad name and in the end we are being flamed too. Nothing you can do about this tho.