Meditation/Visualization: Tips?

[Darin Rosewood]

Yeah, since I effectively suck at them, I'd like to learn how to improve my abilities in either or both. Any help at all will be appreciated. My main problems:
Meditation: I can't keep concentration very well, and I'm not sure exactly what to expect. How do I know when I'm doing it right?
Visualization: I can get an image in my head fairly well, the problem is keeping it there. Also, same problem as meditation, I'm not entirely sure where the balance is between imagining something there and actually seeing it (which I've never been able to do).  

[MoonJeli]

I'm no expert. I can speak for meditation but not visualization. First, there are a lot of different kinds of meditation, which fall into the categories of concentrative or mindfulness, such as Vipassana, Transcendental, Zen, Siddha Yoga, etc. These can be still (i.e. Lotus position on a pillow) or chaotic (jumping around and flailing) or just going about your daily routine mindfully. What type are you referring to?

From your post I'm guessing a generic (non-dogmatic) concentrative, where you hold your body still and control your attention. Correct me if I'm wrong.

For this type I'd say practice really does help. The key is not to HOLD ON to thoughts. You will have thoughts. You can't stop thoughts from happening. Many say the key to meditation is to let go of the thoughts as soon as they happen.

Concentrative meditation is where you focus your attention on a single thing, such as breathing, an image (mental, or staring at a candle flame, or whatever), or a sound (a mantra) in order to clear and still the mind.

Humans all have "monkey mind". When you're starting out meditating, using "one" as a generic example mantra, the scene in your mind is something like,

"One... one... was that the cat? Oh, I shouldn't think about that, I'm supposed to be meditating. One, one... I hope he didn't knock something down, maybe I should check -- oh, shoot. One -- I shouldn't think about that. One... one... one... did I turn off the oven? Oh, another thought... one... one..."

Etc.

With practice it gets to be more, "One... one... cat... one... one... one... one... laundry? one... one...."

When you have a thought, acknowledge that you have the thought, then let it go. Don't fight.

In my opinion, if you want to get beyond the basics, you really do need to study, and find a mentor or teacher.

Monks spend years studying meditation before they can reach advanced states of meditation. Don't worry that nothing fantastic or transcendental happens when you meditate. Even at its simplest, most amateur forms, meditation has been found to have a great affect on a body's health. It is a skill, and the more you put into it the more you get.

I'm not an expert, and I'd love to hear other's tips on this, or if they have other experiences.  

[TeaDidikai]

MoonJeli

or chaotic (jumping around and flailing)

Were I not in such a good mood, I would be offended at you confusing motion and kenetic energy with "chaos".

Quote:

In my opinion, if you want to get beyond the basics, you really do need to study, and find a mentor or teacher.

I'm inclined to disagree.

Mentors and Teachers aren't something one should go off searching for whilly nilly.

After all, Barns and Noble and Practice can teach a lot about meditation that Darin doesn't know about.
Further- it is easier to close a book than a person.  

[PurpleDragonsGems]

I have pretty much the same troubles with both meditation and visualization. Can any one give a list and brief description of different types of meditation?  

[Deoridhe]

The few times I've successfully meditated it's either been guided (which is all but pathwalking) or tradak. Tradak is meditating by staring at a candle flame. The object is to keep your eyes focused but soft and to blink as little as possible. I quite enjoy it.

Another method is to find objects of focus; mental images like flowers or something else. Focus on one until you can't anymore, then focus on the second, and so on and so forth.

Another is counting your breaths.

Tradak remains the only one I really enjoy, though.  

[saint dreya]

Deoridhe

Another is counting your breaths.

i'll have to ask more on it, but one of the recommended ways for "newbs" (at my grove) is called "99 breaths".  

[Pelta]

Clocks make for goodness. Or possibly annoyance depending on how much you like its tick...

I rarely do completely blank meditations. I find I get bored, although they leave you feeling all lovely afterwards. I tend to do something like that to get myself to fall asleep when I'm thinking too much.

Otherwise I'm an avid Traveller. Pathwalking and visualisation came very naturally to me. It's what I do.

As for ways to help, imagination is fun. Exploring mystery landscapes is also good. I find focusing on one single thing too much becomes painful. Lots of things are about change - focusing on one image's staticness (if that's a word) I find is not conducive to full visualisation.  

[jaden kendam]

I know many people who use flames or classical music or both. Me? I never need to meditate to communicate with spirit. I have been known to do messages on the phone and having a normal conversation at the same time.  

[Darin Rosewood]

TeaDidikai

After all, Barns and Noble and Practice can teach a lot about meditation that Darin doesn't know about.

There's a lot of things I don't know about. Don't rub it in. crying  

[jaden kendam]

Darin Rosewood

TeaDidikai

After all, Barns and Noble and Practice can teach a lot about meditation that Darin doesn't know about.

There's a lot of things I don't know about. Don't rub it in. crying

She was just saying, I think, that Barnes and Nobles have books on the subject. As well as practicing. I dont think she was being offensive.  

[Aya Azura]

You know when you're doing it right when you lose spatial awareness. This is just something I do, but I sit on wood floor, so I know when I'm gone. Also, it feels timeless. I can't say for others what the best sort of meditation is, because different things work for different people, but breathing is relatively general. There's a breathing exercise I do when I'm feeling too stressed. Breathe in for a count of four, hold for two, breathe out for five. I find that really helps. For visualization, I suck. Like literally. I'm actually doing exercises now, to help get better, from the Correllian Tradition, but you might try Cds, that lead you somewhere, because I find it works better for me, if I'm being led in meditation, but I'm trying to work out of. The best way to get better though is through PRACTICE!!! Strengthen your psychic muscle. Hope I helped.
Namaste.  

[MoonJeli]

TeaDidikai

MoonJeli

or chaotic (jumping around and flailing)

Were I not in such a good mood, I would be offended at you confusing motion and kenetic energy with "chaos".

Sorry.

Quote:

Quote:

In my opinion, if you want to get beyond the basics, you really do need to study, and find a mentor or teacher.

I'm inclined to disagree.

Mentors and Teachers aren't something one should go off searching for whilly nilly.

After all, Barns and Noble and Practice can teach a lot about meditation that Darin doesn't know about.
Further- it is easier to close a book than a person.

You don't think the books teach basic meditation, rather than the advanced states reached by Buddhist monks, etc.?  

[Darin Rosewood]

deadmanjake

Darin Rosewood

TeaDidikai

After all, Barns and Noble and Practice can teach a lot about meditation that Darin doesn't know about.

There's a lot of things I don't know about. Don't rub it in. crying

She was just saying, I think, that Barnes and Nobles have books on the subject. As well as practicing. I dont think she was being offensive.

I know what she was saying, I just like doing that. If you see a crying emote in my post, you know II'm joking. Usually. Sometimes. >_> <_<  

[Deoridhe]

MoonJeli

You don't think the books teach basic meditation, rather than the advanced states reached by Buddhist monks, etc.?

Just because a person can reach a meditative state doesn't mean they can teach it well.

Also, given the OP states he is unskilled, starting him at a Ph.D. level of meditation seems rather counterintuitive.  

[jaden kendam]

Deoridhe

MoonJeli

You don't think the books teach basic meditation, rather than the advanced states reached by Buddhist monks, etc.?

Just because a person can reach a meditative state doesn't mean they can teach it well.

Also, given the OP states he is unskilled, starting him at a Ph.D. level of meditation seems rather counterintuitive.

Some of the books I have heard about regarding meditation seem to be at kindergarden level. Close your eyes, breath deep, have incense burning, and have a "sounds of nature" cd playing.

Personaly find the incense irritating to my eyes, nose, and lungs. And sometimes, the sounds of nature things just make me want to use the potty.