Trying to find "here" in "incoherence"

[NoSuchCreature]

I find myself in an interesting position these days. You see, as an eclectic out of both preference and respectful caution, I've discovered the drawback to the approach of a one-man religion.

There is no structure to my belief system. At all. I can hardly define what I believe at any permanent time, let alone stick to it.

I've considered the thought of looking into Discordianism and things of that nature, but as much as I love throwing myself into an oblivion high, I wouldn't mind just a little structure to work around in, maybe some ideals. I mean, I'd at least like to keep practical with my beliefs, at least to the extent that I still have a perfectly good reason for me as well as anyone else to live and to abide by the generic laws of the land.

I'm not much for just hopping from one organized paradigm as I have a distinct ego about who I am and what I stand for, so I have a bit of unease (call it meta-motion sickness if you will) about having a stable definition of "me."

So, I feel like I should go looking for a total epiphany. After all, it seems "drawing influence from multiple sources" just won't be enough sources for me to choose from to get a fully personalized religion Well, maybe it can, but I'm too lazy to go looking for speciifc things to research and a start from scratch method sounds good to me anyway >>;.

To clarify, it's a bit like the Gaian system of dressing up an avatar. Eclectic Paganism, in the most general sense, is simply picking off of ideas that have already been done. In other words, it's just like getting pre-made pixel formations of clothing to design your own avatar. As the need for new additions to the selection of these proves, not even this will guaranteededly match up to what your ideal for your beliefs/avatar will be.

In fact, my own avatar is a perfect example of this. In a perfect world, I'd want an avatar exactly like the persona in my sig. Unfortunately, Gaia doesn't offer the option of octagonal blank eyes or octopus arms sprouting out of your back, so I am left with substitutes (zorro mask and lunar cape).

This is how my beliefs are. All I've had access to thoughtwise are bits and pieces of other religions. That's fine and dandy for having a grasp of the world basic enough to function in, but as my scatterbrain style has shown to me, I need much more than the pieces conveniently made for me. I need to go outside of the box and find divine inspiration where no divinity was ever defined to exist, and find things out for myself.

I need to put myself out into a spiritual quest because; as my efforts for a magically-induced product stymied by the questions of what I want, if I can get it, and how I can get it, have shown; I can't just have a one-man religon. I need a one-man church for my knowledge and awareness of the world around me to be satisfying.

Making the transition from a rant to a discussable subject, I ask all of you- what are your thoughts for me in my notion of searching for my own doctrine? What would you suggest I do to find it? Once found, how do I establish it? Is it even worth shooting for?

Any suggestions, support, or commentary of any kind would be greatly appreciated.  

[Gideon Starorzewski]

Fluffy Little Octopus

So, I feel like I should go looking for a total epiphany.

Is that even possible, going looking for an epiphany? I've always been under the impression that they go looking for you and generally appear unnanounced. Epiphanies, although generally helpful, are terrible houseguests.  

[Tsuzuki]

Fluffy Little Octopus

I need to put myself out into a spiritual quest because; as my efforts for a magically-induced product stymied by the questions of what I want, if I can get it, and how I can get it, have shown; I can't just have a one-man religon. I need a one-man church for my knowledge and awareness of the world around me to be satisfying.

Unfortunately, I don't think that's possible unless you appoint someone else to have power over you. Being your own Pope is a tall order, and there is nothing separating you from the abyss. You're just going to have to get used to a bit of meta-motion sickness, unless you want to make it a church of at least two.  

[NoSuchCreature]

Gideon Starorzewski

Is that even possible, going looking for an epiphany? I've always been under the impression that they go looking for you and generally appear unnanounced. Epiphanies, although generally helpful, are terrible houseguests.

At the time of posting this thread, I thought it was worth a try. sweatdrop At the very least, I'd like to accelerate any oncoming inspiration.

Tsuzuki

Unfortunately, I don't think that's possible unless you appoint someone else to have power over you. Being your own Pope is a tall order, and there is nothing separating you from the abyss. You're just going to have to get used to a bit of meta-motion sickness, unless you want to make it a church of at least two.

sweatdrop Did I use a poor choice of words for what I meant by "church?" If I failed in providing clarity (as this thread suggests, it wouldn't be a first of mine), I meant a clearly visible doctrine and self-made tradition.

In the case that you did translate that right, well, darn. I suppose I'd better start eating lighter lunches. neutral  

[Tsuzuki]

Fluffy Little Octopus

Tsuzuki

Unfortunately, I don't think that's possible unless you appoint someone else to have power over you. Being your own Pope is a tall order, and there is nothing separating you from the abyss. You're just going to have to get used to a bit of meta-motion sickness, unless you want to make it a church of at least two.

sweatdrop Did I use a poor choice of words for what I meant by "church?" If I failed in providing clarity (as this thread suggests, it wouldn't be a first of mine), I meant a clearly visible doctrine and self-made tradition.

In the case that you did translate that right, well, darn. I suppose I'd better start eating lighter lunches. neutral

Having a visible doctrine and tradition requires having an enforcement element to keep them stable. If you later on decide to deviate from your original path, are you going to declare yourself a heretic and boot yourself from your own one-man church? Even if you remain faithful to your original intent, you still have to contend with the maddening freedoms that leave you hanging over the abyss. I suggest you carry a barf bag. I know I've got several.  

[Gideon Starorzewski]

Fluffy Little Octopus

At the time of posting this thread, I thought it was worth a try. sweatdrop At the very least, I'd like to accelerate any oncoming inspiration.

I think that most of us would like to accelerate oncoming inspiration, bt there's really only so much you can do. My personal experience has been that if you rush into something you'll burn out quickly. Pace yourself, it's much healthier.  

[NoSuchCreature]

Tsuzuki

Having a visible doctrine and tradition requires having an enforcement element to keep them stable. If you later on decide to deviate from your original path, are you going to declare yourself a heretic and boot yourself from your own one-man church? Even if you remain faithful to your original intent, you still have to contend with the maddening freedoms that leave you hanging over the abyss. I suggest you carry a barf bag. I know I've got several.

gonk Well, there goes the fantastic hopes of going Mt. Sinai on things and coming back with a full satisfaction of the world's relevant mysteries.

How about soul searching a little bit to know what I actually believe, at least, at the current time? Would that benefit me and quell my confused teen ego a bit? If so, would there be any suggestions as to finding that?

Gideon Starorzewski

I think that most of us would like to accelerate oncoming inspiration, bt there's really only so much you can do. My personal experience has been that if you rush into something you'll burn out quickly. Pace yourself, it's much healthier.

Very well, but I'd still like to kick it up a notch, at least know where I'm at, if not where I'm going regarding a worldly understanding.  

[Tsuzuki]

Fluffy Little Octopus

Tsuzuki

Having a visible doctrine and tradition requires having an enforcement element to keep them stable. If you later on decide to deviate from your original path, are you going to declare yourself a heretic and boot yourself from your own one-man church? Even if you remain faithful to your original intent, you still have to contend with the maddening freedoms that leave you hanging over the abyss. I suggest you carry a barf bag. I know I've got several.

gonk Well, there goes the fantastic hopes of going Mt. Sinai on things and coming back with a full satisfaction of the world's relevant mysteries.

You can still do that. But if you think that Moses himself was even remotely comfortable you'd be mistaken. Talking to gods tends to make people's heads spin.

Fluffy Little Octopus

How about soul searching a little bit to know what I actually believe, at least, at the current time? Would that benefit me and quell my confused teen ego a bit? If so, would there be any suggestions as to finding that?

You're on the right track, but don't expect it to be a cake walk. Expect migraines and madness.  

[NoSuchCreature]

Tsuzuki

You can still do that. But if you think that Moses himself was even remotely comfortable you'd be mistaken. Talking to gods tends to make people's heads spin.

Admittedly ignorant of what sort of magnitude this headspinning reaches, I think I could deal with that, or at least learning the hard way not to do it again. 3nodding

Tsuzuki

You're on the right track, but don't expect it to be a cake walk. Expect migraines and madness.

Gah, the two things I was trying to get rid of in the first place! >.< I suppose I'll just get over that bit of irony and brace myself from now on then.  

[bobz]

I understand exactly where you're coming from here. Funnily enough I've found that epiphany doesn't come from runnning fast after it, it comes when you stop, sit down and forget about it... Then it drops in like a ninja, leaves a ninjaburger with extra fries and poofles again, generally when you're not even looking for food.

I'm still looking for my structure right now, I get the feeling that it's just around the corner or over the hump, but when it comes right down to it it's going to have to be your structure and your rules.
Just watch out for dogma, it's as hard, unforgiving and sharp as the "ninja stars for little humans" you'll find in the ninjaburger meal-bag.  

[Shavis]

Quote:

I understand exactly where you're coming from here. Funnily enough I've found that epiphany doesn't come from runnning fast after it, it comes when you stop, sit down and forget about it... Then it drops in like a ninja, leaves a ninjaburger with extra fries and poofles again, generally when you're not even looking for food.

I'm still looking for my structure right now, I get the feeling that it's just around the corner or over the hump, but when it comes right down to it it's going to have to be your structure and your rules.
Just watch out for dogma, it's as hard, unforgiving and sharp as the "ninja stars for little humans" you'll find in the ninjaburger meal-bag.

I find bobz analogy here to be rather effective though I would like to point out... epiphany doesn't commit Seppuku if it doesn't deliver in 30 minutes...
Also, While the outside world can provide an acceptable set of guidelines, the end decision and connection must be your own in total. Relying on someone elses view of faith for something as personal as faith must be is foolhardy and will only frustrate you in the end... or turn you into a pathetic dogmabot.... either way, find your own path...  

[saint dreya]

Shavis

either way, find your own path...

i see this time and time again. and have to wonder...

it's still perfectly fine and capable idea to find one's own path amidst an established path. what is so wrong with taking the road more traveled? is it such an abomination that many people care to tread this path?

i understand the need to hearken out into the wilderness to find one's own path under the debris, but is it truly even that horrid to trod along the known and well-traveled path, even for brief moments throughtout one's journey?  

[TatteredAngel]

I think the "going on a quest" bit is going to be more viable than searching for some epiphany, unpredictable timing at best- and the real b***h about epiphanies is they aren't always what you think you're looking for.

I feel for where you're coming from. I kept looking for the way to believe, the system that would fit me like a glove, where myself and other likeminded people would be right there together, doing things- and it never happened. I tried on labels, and eventually rejected them. The only thing I'll really own to now is that I am a syncretic, that I really do try to blend a large variety of beliefs into one thing.

I understand what you mean about wanting the one-man church, but the nature of these things tends to be that structure has to be taken from elsewhere, and from other groups. If that makes sense- that since you cannot, for example, appeal to an authority on your particular beliefs as a whole for answers to tricky questions, you have to do what you can in asking around.

Is it worth it? I can only answer for me- and it has been. That an amalgamation is more representative of how I see the world and truth than any one group I have looked at. I have not been called to particular gods, and I have followed what affinities I do feel- from various places. I am open and honest about my belief system, and don't try to grab at the things that are not open to me, and most people have been nothing but courteous about it, even when I'm asking the weird questions born of syncretism. The drawback of doing things this way is that there will likely never be a community you are on the page with one hundred percent, or one singular way of approaching even your own doctrine- what you are doing is by nature multifaceted.

I don't know if any of that helps, but that's my two cents on the matter.  

[Shavis]

phoenix shadowwolf

Shavis

either way, find your own path...

i see this time and time again. and have to wonder...

it's still perfectly fine and capable idea to find one's own path amidst an established path. what is so wrong with taking the road more traveled? is it such an abomination that many people care to tread this path?

i understand the need to hearken out into the wilderness to find one's own path under the debris, but is it truly even that horrid to trod along the known and well-traveled path, even for brief moments throughtout one's journey?

You misunderstand. I find it more than acceptable to take from established paths. But yes, it is an abomination to simply assimilate into someone else's beliefs. Faith is a deeply personal matter and to simply give over entirely to someone else's view of right is a travesty. Take what you need and can use and all else is unnecessary.  

[saint dreya]

Shavis

phoenix shadowwolf

Shavis

either way, find your own path...

i see this time and time again. and have to wonder...

it's still perfectly fine and capable idea to find one's own path amidst an established path. what is so wrong with taking the road more traveled? is it such an abomination that many people care to tread this path?

i understand the need to hearken out into the wilderness to find one's own path under the debris, but is it truly even that horrid to trod along the known and well-traveled path, even for brief moments throughtout one's journey?

You misunderstand. I find it more than acceptable to take from established paths. But yes, it is an abomination to simply assimilate into someone else's beliefs. Faith is a deeply personal matter and to simply give over entirely to someone else's view of right is a travesty. Take what you need and can use and all else is unnecessary.

i didn't mean to imply that you did. just a general note to all.

also...the last line is rather eclectic and while might work for some practices, i think it might be slightly disrespectful to certain cultures to pick and choose from their practices.

eek i think i actually understand Chaiyo and reagun now!