Has the Term "Wicca" Evolved?

[Luna Black Wolf]

Hey...so when I was getting into an argument with a Wiccan over the actual term "Wicca", it dawned on me that the term evolved from just the gardner's term WICA (legit spelling ya'll, even the Wiccans can't spell Gardner's religion right!!) to involving all of us who practice along those lines...Just it's confusing the hell out of me, and is kinda offensive, since I'm feeling like Wiccans are trying to alienate others who aren't like them...which just sucks, cause that's why I was so into the religion...cause I felt like I belonged somewhere finally!

Help??


Here's my little bit of proof the term evolved:

World English Dictionary

— n
( sometimes not capital ) the cult or practice of witchcraft

Dictionary.com

–noun
( sometimes initial capital letter ) witchcraft, especially benevolent, nature-oriented practices derived from pre-Christian religions.

 

[Satyr Prince]

no.

Wicca is an Orthopraxic, Oathbound, Initiatory, Mystery-based, Experiential, Coven-based, Fertility-focused, Ditheistic Witch-cult whose members are all Clergy within a Lineaged Tradition.

that's it.

neopagans trying to shanghai the term are not "just as legit" or however they argue.

-edit-
to avoid confusion, my "just as legit" line refers to the usage of the term, not their beliefs in and of themselves.  

[too2sweet]

Since the majority of the people who claim that it means something different are those who have never been initiated, I don't see where they have any authority to make any changes to the word's meaning.

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I was so into the religion...cause I felt like I belonged somewhere finally!

If what you are practicing is working well for you, that is wonderful. No one (unless you are doing some major cultural misappropriations) is knocking what you practice - what they are saying is that your practices have been mislabeled. So feel free to continue as you were - just don't call it Wicca.  

[maenad nuri]

It's important to note that dictionaries record popular usage, and not always technical usage. It's also important to note that Gardner also occasionally used Wicca instead of Wica.

If the changes had been made from people within Wicca, then I think we could say, "yes, it has evolved" but instead it came from people who either left Wicca or never were Wicca and then when it hit Feminist Spirituality....whoa boy, thats when the problems really happened.

And of course, just because a title you were using is incorrect has no bearing on the legitimacy or respectability of your beliefs and practices. I don't think Wiccans are looking to alienate, but they do have the right to say, "No, you aren't Wiccan unless...."  

[Collowrath]

I'm with nuri. If the definition of the word were to change, that change would come from within. The dictionary records the popular usage, which may very well be wrong. Lineaged Wiccans, having coined the term for their usage, are still the authority as to what exactly that term means, regardless of how anyone else misuses it.  

[Esiris]

My HPS has said that she feels the battle over who uses the term Wicca has been lost- and her choice is to distinguish between what she knows Wicca to be and other groups using the title.

I got to talk with her about this during the weekend intensive. Her opinion confirmed my experience- that there are lots of different opinions amongst the Wiccans themselves.

At some point a religion changes so much that it's not the same anymore- like if someone insisted Wiccans weren't witches, or that Wicca wasn't a fertility religion, I'd think that no matter what you think- the word Wicca wouldn't fit anymore.

The other think to consider is courtesy- if someone understands their oaths to mean that whenever someone who isn't an initiate claims to be Wiccan does so- they have to take a stance against that- the person who isn't an initiate is going to be stirring up a lot of muck.

Luna Black Wolf

I'm feeling like Wiccans are trying to alienate others who aren't like them...which just sucks, cause that's why I was so into the religion...cause I felt like I belonged somewhere finally!

My HPS participates in lots of non-Wiccan pagan events- so I don't really see what she does as alienating anyone- just protecting what she has sworn to protect.

What about what you thought was Wicca made you feel like you belonged?  

[Luna Black Wolf]

I liked a lot about it. I like knowing that I have the power to control my own life (within reason, since I still live with my folks), I like the idea of a coven being another family, learning together, and always being there for the other. I've always felt like my diety was never up in the sky watching down on me, but within me, waiting to be called forth to talk to everyday. Giving food and drink not only to ourselves but also to the forest and others, and I love the fact that we respect everything, from another homosapien to the tree that I take a leaf from. Just so much connected to me the second I got my first "Wiccan" book, but the second I couldn't find a coven (and creating one is kinda out of the question...Catholic school restricts the number of people who want to study it with me), I had to settle with teaching myself, reading every single book I could get my hand on and taking notes vigourously. I can't even find a teacher within a 2 hours drive...and I've tried every site I could think of.  

[saint dreya]

Luna Black Wolf

I liked a lot about it. I like knowing that I have the power to control my own life (within reason, since I still live with my folks),

Wicca isn't the only religion or philosophy that might give someone this feeling.

Luna Black Wolf

I like the idea of a coven being another family, learning together, and always being there for the other.

You can get that with a lot of different religions as well. I have that with my grove in ADF and my Kindred through the Troth.

Luna Black Wolf

I've always felt like my diety was never up in the sky watching down on me, but within me, waiting to be called forth to talk to everyday.

A lot of pagan religions have that concept.

Luna Black Wolf

Giving food and drink not only to ourselves but also to the forest and others, and I love the fact that we respect everything, from another homosapien to the tree that I take a leaf from.

Particularly nature based religions have this concept. However, Wicca isn't nature based.

Luna Black Wolf

Just so much connected to me the second I got my first "Wiccan" book,

What was the name of that book, out of curiousity?

Luna Black Wolf

but the second I couldn't find a coven (and creating one is kinda out of the question...Catholic school restricts the number of people who want to study it with me), I had to settle with teaching myself, reading every single book I could get my hand on and taking notes vigourously. I can't even find a teacher within a 2 hours drive...and I've tried every site I could think of.

I don't know if you've posted this before...how old are you?

You said that you lived at home and are in Catholic school - if you are under 18, usually local residents will require parental consent if they are to take you under. And that's assuming they will even entertain the notion. They might simply say, "you're not of age, we won't teach you until you are."

This post is not to invalidate what you believe or practice. However, it's not in line with what Wicca actually is.

So it's not Wicca. And? That doesn't lessen what you believe in. That doesn't suddenly mean everything you think is wrong. It deserves a name, by all means, but a name that fits. A name that describes it accurately. Not something that is very different and would give the wrong impression to someone who it was being described to.  

[kage no neko]

Mind you, the point is that Wicca is a specific religion. There are other branches and religions and paths out there that you can fit in just fine. Don't restrict yourself to something like that.

And it doesn't take a Wiccan or even a pagan to respect, enjoy, and appreciate nature.  

[Esiris]

Luna Black Wolf

I liked a lot about it. I like knowing that I have the power to control my own life (within reason, since I still live with my folks),

Do you think maybe working towards being independent would be a better use of your time and energy while accomplishing that same goal?

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I like the idea of a coven being another family,

It's a family- they're loved ones, but it isn't a replacement family. Are you happy with the family you have?

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and always being there for the other.

As my HPS has said- Wicca isn't therapy circle, it's service. Yeah- some of the Wicca may go out of their way to help their own, but there's a time and place for it, and understanding that is part of being mature and serving the Lord and Lady instead of serving yourself.

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I've always felt like my diety was never up in the sky watching down on me, but within me, waiting to be called forth to talk to everyday.

There is some of Gardner's writings that talk about the Sun God and the Moon Goddess- there's a lot in what he wrote about how the God and Goddess are in the bigger scheme of things.

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Giving food and drink not only to ourselves but also to the forest and others, and I love the fact that we respect everything, from another homosapien to the tree that I take a leaf from.

Being Wiccan doesn't make you a respectful person- believe me. My HPS doesn't respect a lot of the BS that goes on around her. 3nodding

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Just so much connected to me the second I got my first "Wiccan" book,

Which book was it? To me- that would make a huge difference between you feeling a connection to Wicca and feeling a connection to something else that was mislabeled Wicca.

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but the second I couldn't find a coven (and creating one is kinda out of the question...Catholic school restricts the number of people who want to study it with me), I had to settle with teaching myself, reading every single book I could get my hand on and taking notes vigourously. I can't even find a teacher within a 2 hours drive...and I've tried every site I could think of.

Being initiated into Wicca takes time- and effort. My HPS lives hours away- and we commute to each other. That costs us time and gas and wear and tear on our vehicles and effort and money!

And that isn't a bad thing- anything worth doing is worth doing right.  

[breuddwyd]

It's not my intention to down anyone's beliefs or what they say but there's a lot of 'my hps said this' and 'my hps said that'... so did you sign away your independant thought?

I don't think Wicca was meant for anyone to be 'higher' than any other person, or their name seen as some kind of qualification or justification; the name just means you happen to have some knowledge to pass on to others and that you're pretty much the designated co-ordinator...

Anyway, I hate to say this but my impressions of initiated Wicca is that it is slightly elitist sometimes, not necessarily in most cases, and that's what made me throw that name away when I started using it, as an uninitiated person.

I'm just a hedgewitch, magus and spiritualist (depending on who I'm talking to).

Anyway, there are lots of names that could go for what you're practicing - from certain paths (From Asatru to Yoruba) to simple catagories (From non-theistic to poly-theistic) to the umbrella terms: spiritualism, sorcery, witchcraft, magic (therefore being a magus, magician...)...

I don't have a right to say you can't call yourself a Wiccan... but it's a bit like Protestants aren't Catholics, right? Different structure and all but they've got the big JC in common. (Jesus is hell cool!) lol.

The current in term around here is 'holistic spiritualism'( Edit: by 'here' I mean the UK at least, sorry for any confusion if it caused any)... which is, I guess, another way of saying health and wellbeing orientated eclectic (mixing things up a little) high magic (trying to get enlightenment, spiritual understanding, emotional healing etc. rather than material gains). It highly supports independant work and working together. I wish I was in a coven, and I used to reeeeeeeeeeally want to get initiated into Wicca (as in it was almost about to happen but then the people who were going to initiate me had their first grandson (awwwww he's sssssooooo cuuuute!) and didn't have time)... but now apart from the fact I like not having someone who is supposed to tread a higher path than me (I still respect these people because they're pretty much spiritual elders, they've devoted a lot more than me to it) but my beliefs are faaaar to flexible to do it. I mean I just started studying Buddhism.

Anyway, sorry for the slightly disrespectfull attitude, I need to make it sure I highly respect Wicca... It's just not compatible with me. But I posted just because I wanted to share the possibilities of other terms with you.  

[Satyr Prince]

Esiris

My HPS has said that she feels the battle over who uses the term Wicca has been lost- and her choice is to distinguish between what she knows Wicca to be and other groups using the title.

idk, i personally still feel like its a battle worth fighting. then again, im known to champion uphill battles. i feel insulted when some little mis-informed neopagan TELLS me im "Wiccan" when i'm not, just because i practice magic and am polythiestic. not even taking the time to realize the difference between the ritual magic you guys use and the low kitchen magic i use. heart  

[saint dreya]

breuddwyd

It's not my intention to down anyone's beliefs or what they say but there's a lot of 'my hps said this' and 'my hps said that'... so did you sign away your independant thought?

Given how Wicca is an orthopraxic religion, requiring initiation by a HPS, who generally has had a number of other initiations into the mysteries, I don't see why them referring to a source of verified knowledge is "signing away your independent thought". It honestly sounds just like if I were to tell you what my instructors say about my radar, or what my Captain says about how sailors on base are behaving.

breuddwyd

I don't think Wicca was meant for anyone to be 'higher' than any other person, or their name seen as some kind of qualification or justification; the name just means you happen to have some knowledge to pass on to others and that you're pretty much the designated co-ordinator...

It's not a "higher" than title. It has specific requirements for one to fulfill for them to accurately be called a Wiccan.

Would you be a US Navy Sailor without going through boot camp and passing battle stations? No, and to claim otherwise is not only lying, but devaluing the experience and sacrifices of those who have completed these things.

breuddwyd

Anyway, I hate to say this but my impressions of initiated Wicca is that it is slightly elitist sometimes, not necessarily in most cases, and that's what made me throw that name away when I started using it, as an uninitiated person.

It's not elitist. Sorry you feel that way. Glad you seemed to have found something that fits you better.

breuddwyd

Anyway, there are lots of names that could go for what you're practicing - from certain paths (From Asatru to Yoruba) to simple catagories (From non-theistic to poly-theistic) to the umbrella terms: spiritualism, sorcery, witchcraft, magic (therefore being a magus, magician...)...

Exactly! And they are perfectly fine labels, completely valid and in no way considered less than Wiccan.

breuddwyd

I don't have a right to say you can't call yourself a Wiccan... but it's a bit like Protestants aren't Catholics, right? Different structure and all but they've got the big JC in common. (Jesus is hell cool!) lol.

Sorta, but you're getting the gist.  

[Esiris]

breuddwyd

It's not my intention to down anyone's beliefs or what they say but there's a lot of 'my hps said this' and 'my hps said that'... so did you sign away your independant thought?

That is incredibly rude- down right insulting and saying "I don't intend to..." only to say something so insulting is really messed up and unwelcomed.

No- I did not sign away my independent thought- I know my place though. I'm not an initiate and I'm no so arrogant to pretend that someone outside of the religion- like me- has any place in telling an elder of that religion who has served for decades what's what.

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I don't think Wicca was meant for anyone to be 'higher' than any other person, or their name seen as some kind of qualification or justification; the name just means you happen to have some knowledge to pass on to others and that you're pretty much the designated co-ordinator...

Wicca is a religion of equality, with the HPS being "first amongst equals"- when in doubt when it comes to a coven and it's decisions- her word is law.

A good example of this is that a HPS wanted to do a year long ritual working with the coven and she put it to a vote, no one else was interested and since she wasn't too attached to the idea it didn't happen. If it had been something she had been attached to- they would have done it.

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Anyway, I hate to say this but my impressions of initiated Wicca is that it is slightly elitist sometimes, not necessarily in most cases, and that's what made me throw that name away when I started using it, as an uninitiated person.

A lot of times people who don't want to do the heavy lifting look at those who expect something of them as "elitist" in my experience. I've been called elitist by other seekers just because I think it's appropriate to put in the effort an HP or HPS asks of their seekers.

So many neo-pagans come into this stuff looking for an easy fix to their dissatisfaction with organized religion, or to have someone tell them their special and magical- looking for empowerment from the outside.

Well- to paraphrase, if you can't find it in yourself to begin with, you're not going to find it outside of yourself.

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I don't have a right to say you can't call yourself a Wiccan... but it's a bit like Protestants aren't Catholics, right? Different structure and all but they've got the big JC in common. (Jesus is hell cool!) lol.

Wicca is a specific religion- it's more like saying Catholic's aren't Hindu.

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I wish I was in a coven, and I used to reeeeeeeeeeally want to get initiated into Wicca

Maybe that's the problem- you wanted something instead of being called to it? My experience is that people who are called to serve the Lord and Lady find where they belong even if it isn't easy as pie.

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but now apart from the fact I like not having someone who is supposed to tread a higher path than me

Tread a higher path? I've got no clue what you're talking about. Elders are elders and HP/S are HP/S because they put the time and effort in- not because they're "higher", they're trained.

If you go to college, you listen to your professors and learn. Someday you may be a professor, someday you may work in the field, you could even end up being a student for the rest of your life- that doesn't make a professor better than you.

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Anyway, sorry for the slightly disrespectfull attitude,

I don't take apologies from people who say they're sorry but do the wrong anyway. You could have shared the other terms without questioning my ability to think for myself and you chose to do it anyway. You also misrepresented what Wicca is.

Yes- I have indendent thought, and I think what you said is bogus.

Strega Mama

idk, i personally still feel like its a battle worth fighting. then again, im known to champion uphill battles.

When you're looking around in Wicca- you get a lot of different view points. My HPS has made her decision for herself, and the more I learn the better equipped I'll be to make my own decision.

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i feel insulted when some little mis-informed neopagan TELLS me im "Wiccan" when i'm not, just because i practice magic and am polythiestic.

See- I think that's a good stand to take. If they're telling you that you are something you're not, give them hell! blaugh

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not even taking the time to realize the difference between the ritual magic you guys use and the low kitchen magic i use. heart

I use kitchen magic. emo  

[Satyr Prince]

Esiris

I use kitchen magic. emo

i must have mis-worded myself, i've encountered folks that assume kitchen magic is somehow the same thing, not that the two are exclusive of each other.