Cross-Tradition Participation

[TeaDidikai]

So I attend open rituals now and then with the PFA, and some smaller things organized by specific groups, mostly community events hosted by some of the local Alexandrians.

Generic Eclectic Neo-Pagan theology has little common ground with my tradition. And while I am very picky about which rituals I participate in, and even more picky about the company I keep, as long as the practice doesn't violate any prohibitions, I don't mind doing things the way my host expects them to be done. Hospitality and all that.

But it does bring up an interesting point of thought. How willing are you to participate in rituals outside of your tradition?

What accommodations do you make for others?
What standards for participation do you hold?  

[Recursive Paradox]

TeaDidikai

But it does bring up an interesting point of thought. How willing are you to participate in rituals outside of your tradition?

It depends on the people, the ritual and the path. For instance, any ritual that directly involves worship or praise to another being is not viable for me.

Certain religions operate in a way that is not conducive to the Three Pillars and if the ritual or the people could in any way edge me towards the Path of Decay or would act in violation of the Pillars, I would have to decline working with them.

Beyond that, I'm quite willing to participate with other paths. Etherism is so small that community isn't very forthcoming. And even as it grows, it's a somewhat solitary path so community still won't be very forthcoming.

I don't mind working with other beings, even deities, as long as I'm not submitting, worshiping, or following them in my actions. The relationship should be like those of mine with the Aspects, barter or equal partnership.

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What accommodations do you make for others?

I'm still working on that actually. I've yet to accommodate anyone into things involving Etherism, especially since channeling is a part of the mysteries.

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What standards for participation do you hold?

Same as above. Still working on that.  

[Ishtar Shakti]

Well it depends. If I am in my house playing host I will try to accommodate that persons wishes to a point to make them comfortable. When I am at someone elses' house I will follow their rituals to the point that it makes me uncomfortable. As a host I believe it is your responsibility to make the other person feel at home, or at least comfortable and at ease. To do otherwise would be rude.

If I am in a more neutral territory I believe in a sort of mutual off handed respect. If I am in a temple or a holy place the respect I provide will be greater. This includes ritual sites. I try to keep my own will in check and I do not practice in others territories.

It also is somewhat dependent on how much respect others are willing to give me. Some religions if they are overtly hostile or disrespectful I have a tendency to match that level of respect. In such cases I might go against another persons beliefs directly. This is generally something I do without thinking. People who are cocky... I have been known to violate their personal spaces shields etc. because they are overly confident and disrespectful and I know my own power. I consciously try not to do this usually.

Otherwise I will follow their rituals and lend my own power to the proceedings.  

[TeaDidikai]

Ishtar Shakti

As a host I believe it is your responsibility to make the other person feel at home, or at least comfortable and at ease. To do otherwise would be rude.

Between making a guest feel uncomfortable and making my gods feel such, I know who wins this one.

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It also is somewhat dependent on how much respect others are willing to give me. Some religions if they are overtly hostile or disrespectful I have a tendency to match that level of respect.

How about those that merely appear to be such because of your ignorance?

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People who are cocky... I have been known to violate their personal spaces shields etc. because they are overly confident and disrespectful and I know my own power.

So spiritual rape is a reaction you have to people you don't like?  

[Ishtar Shakti]

TeaDidikai

Ishtar Shakti

As a host I believe it is your responsibility to make the other person feel at home, or at least comfortable and at ease. To do otherwise would be rude.

Between making a guest feel uncomfortable and making my gods feel such, I know who wins this one.

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It also is somewhat dependent on how much respect others are willing to give me. Some religions if they are overtly hostile or disrespectful I have a tendency to match that level of respect.

How about those that merely appear to be such because of your ignorance?

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People who are cocky... I have been known to violate their personal spaces shields etc. because they are overly confident and disrespectful and I know my own power.

So spiritual rape is a reaction you have to people you don't like?

I don't have gods thus when I have guests I also cater to their gods. I don't have to worry about that particular nuance. Though my lack of gods can make people feel uncomfortable thus I don't pantimime words if this is the case.

@ the spiritual rape comment... Raping their ritual site is slightly different then raping their person. Its much like pissing on marked territory.
*shrug* My subconscious seems to have a mind of its own.

A spiritual pissing contest seems silly to me most of the time... but then again I have met some very rude people. If a person is going to Overtly insult me... lets say this one person I knew who tried to steal something from me in my own house. Or when I was at their place they invaded my personal space with their energy then my gut reaction is to take everything they have. I don't like people trying to mess with me.

If their god decides to take a moment to try to invade My space without my express invitation then... I may react in a hostile manner. It is mostly subconscious and usually as most people don't do anything I find very hostile this reaction doesn't occur. Its not like most people are very successful in their attempts. Its just offensive.

Eduction should win over revenge don't you think?  

[TeaDidikai]

Ishtar Shakti

I don't have gods thus when I have guests I also cater to their gods. I don't have to worry about that particular nuance. Though my lack of gods can make people feel uncomfortable thus I don't pantimime words if this is the case.

Fair enough. Though I wasn't really talking about you, but about me.

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the spiritual rape comment... Raping their ritual site is slightly different then raping their person.

Then why did you say you violate them?

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Its much like pissing on marked territory.
*shrug* My subconscious seems to have a mind of its own.

So- you have no responsibility for your actions when you profane other's sacred things because you don't like them?

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A spiritual pissing contest seems silly to me most of the time... but then again I have met some very rude people. If a person is going to Overtly insult me... lets say this one person I knew who tried to steal something from me in my own house. Or when I was at their place they invaded my personal space with their energy then my gut reaction is to take everything they have. I don't like people trying to mess with me.

So your gut reaction is to spiritually assault them because you don't know how to behave in response to others?

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Eduction should win over revenge don't you think?

Reminds me of the position an Ex of mine had. I should have learned not to burn his dinner the first time he hit me.  

[Recursive Paradox]

I literally can not think of even a single case where spiritually violating someone would be even remotely excusable. Not even by having a lack of control. In fact, those with a lack of control in terms of violating people, spiritually or physically, strike me as the types that ought to be contained or if that fails, eliminated.

Edit: ******** hell. Just the casual way she referred to such a horrendous violation fills me with rage. People like that are truly disgusting.  

[TeaDidikai]

I guess the upshot of this is that I have a very clear example as to why I am exceptionally careful about who I participate in ritual with.  

[Recursive Paradox]

TeaDidikai

I guess the upshot of this is that I have a very clear example as to why I am exceptionally careful about who I participate in ritual with.

Yeah really. The words "holy ******** s**t" come to mind.  

[TeaDidikai]

Recursive Paradox

Yeah really. The words "holy ******** s**t" come to mind.

Meh. We've seen psy-vamps before.  

[Recursive Paradox]

TeaDidikai

Recursive Paradox

Yeah really. The words "holy ******** s**t" come to mind.

Meh. We've seen psy-vamps before.

I've never seen any that casual about it. Most of them at least have some kind of dramatic excuse, meaning they feel maybe a little bit of shame for being disgusting soul rapists.  

[too2sweet]

Recursive Paradox

I literally can not think of even a single case where spiritually violating someone would be even remotely excusable.

This ^^ Especially if you are an invited guest. If it is something that doesn't suit you, then you can always politely decline to participate and leave. It is not an excuse to violate them in such a personal way.  

[Collowrath]

Heh, when it comes to spiritual violation... wtf? Why? :/ I mean, if someone is trying to hurt you, then stop them however is necessary. As far as "pissing on marked territory" goes - my ritual space is set aside following a very particular standard and violation of that is just downright dangerous.

Most rituals that involve someone outside of my family and home also take place outside my tradition - and for the most part, they are Native American. I very often make accommodations for their traditions, such as allowing myself to be saged (even when the feeling of the sage hitting me feels like a spiritual 2x4). However, there are some things that I would not do - something that would violate a blood taboo, violate an oath or pact that I've made, or violate a period of fasting. Then I would simply ask to be removed and to not participate.  

[TeaDidikai]

Collowrath

Heh, when it comes to spiritual violation... wtf? Why? :/ I mean, if someone is trying to hurt you, then stop them however is necessary. As far as "pissing on marked territory" goes - my ritual space is set aside following a very particular standard and violation of that is just downright dangerous.

Most rituals that involve someone outside of my family and home also take place outside my tradition - and for the most part, they are Native American. I very often make accommodations for their traditions, such as allowing myself to be saged (even when the feeling of the sage hitting me feels like a spiritual 2x4). However, there are some things that I would not do - something that would violate a blood taboo, violate an oath or pact that I've made, or violate a period of fasting. Then I would simply ask to be removed and to not participate.

The major taboo for me when dealing with different Eclectics is invocation.  

[Collowrath]

TeaDidikai

The major taboo for me when dealing with different Eclectics is invocation.

This would be one as well - thanks for mentioning it. There is some precedent for this in certain Slavic traditions (mainly in the Balkans), but for the most part, given my conceptions of bodily and spiritual purity, this would generally be a massive no-no.

In general, for invocation, I'd have to say "oh Gods no," except under the specific circumstances provided for in my tradition.