Help on the Pathways

[Adametokillfor]

As of right now, i'm not sure exactly what I believe in. A dual set of deities, which I have no name for right now because i'm still growing familiar with them and I don't want to give any names untill i'm sure about them and what I am looking for. For the male I see a kinda tall dark haired guy, i've never seen his face fully, but he's a protector. He helps me when I get angry or upset. The female is a little shorter than him with long dark red hair. She's the one who helps me through my sadness and helps me with more creative things. I believe in reincarnation. Not fully sure about magic and such, I see it more as something that allows you to be receptive to things rather than making them happen. I think love spells are bull and people shouldn't use them. Something that makes you more receptive to romance if fine. I believe in the Fates, have for years. Not that we are fully prefated, but if we act a certain way then our fates will be more sealed. The deities that I see are...Not the fluffy deities that people would want "They love us all the time and never are evil", no. While not evil, they can be raging...Just look at a tornado or a monsoon, or a hurricane.

That's the best that I have for now...I was wondering if anyone could offer any help for me to start moving along the path a little faster, or how to get closer to them?  

[Adametokillfor]

One other thing: I'm wondering if there are any Gods who exclusively come to people in animal forms?

If I had to say two animals that i have been extremely close to since I was a small child i'd say a Dog and a Lion.

For the first five years of my life I pretended to be either one. I've always had dogs as companions (I say companions because we've never had a pet that stayed with us for a long time that we didn't feel a connection with ((we being my dad brother and I)) we all had to agree that they were a good animal and then we wouldn't name them for several days to first see what they were like...)

Lions, i've just loved them...Same with Wolves.


I think Loyalty is extremely important, your family should come before everything. Your mate should be important as well. I dunno, there's a lot more I could say, but i'm going ot leave it alone for now  

[Nomad of Nowhere]

I can't read these things like books or anything, but you know, many names for deities are epithets, names that translate to something like "good-striker" or "Lady of wind", which implies that the names are given out of a wordless understanding. If the inability to identify your deities persists, perhaps you should consider simply using an epithet that describes them- a title that makes no presumptions by using names that are culturally charged.

Concerning your animals, please note that I am giving you my personal interpretations as well as general ones. Dogs and wolves have a lot of associations. The Turks had a story about a wolf-father figure that supposedly sired them, and also a story about one of their kings having a wolf for a mother. If you think that the story of Romulus and Remus may possibly reflect this same motiff, then you could interpret it as a symbol of being born for greatness- or alternatively, elevating a people from an "uncivilized" state of hunters as opposed to the urbanized, largely agrarian community that some would have held to be the definition of civilization. Note that both the Romans and the Turks created incredible empires once their civilizations took off. I have read about a wolf-goddess in passing, but the details about her elude me.
In Norse mythology, there's Fenrir, who you would see in a completely different light from the one I've mentioned, unless it's the metaphor of man rising from wolf in reverse; the nomadic hunters conquer the order-bringing gods, although I have significantly more doubt about that one. The wolf is a very striking, distinctive animal, but perhaps because of that, it's symbolically ambiguous. The dog has chthonic associations in at least one culture I can think of, and like the wolf and lion it has been used as a symbol of honor in the past.

Lions are widely accepted as regal animals, and the lioness is a symbol of the Queen of Heaven, Inanna. It is hard for me to see the lion as something other than her symbol, so perhaps you should ask someone else about it. That's all I can think of at the moment. The main thing you should take out of this is how complicated these symbols can be, and not the individual possibilities I have listed.  

[TeaDidikai]

Kitera-the-Red-Mage

A dual set of deities...

This makes a good start to understanding different concepts of deities. Which one suits your understanding?

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I believe in reincarnation.

What purpose does it serve? Is there ever an end to the cycle? What is your understanding of other's interactions with "ghosts"?

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Not fully sure about magic and such, I see it more as something that allows you to be receptive to things rather than making them happen.

How do you define magic? What does your understanding say about other's definitions?

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I think love spells are bull and people shouldn't use them.

If they are "bull" why would it matter if someone used them? What about the people who are in happy long term relationships because of them? What element of their dynamic makes them improper to use?

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I believe in the Fates, have for years.

As in the Hellenic Fates? Or some other tradition that is equivocated with them?

Kitera-the-Red-Mage

One other thing: I'm wondering if there are any Gods who exclusively come to people in animal forms?

If I had to say two animals that i have been extremely close to since I was a small child i'd say a Dog and a Lion.

For the first five years of my life I pretended to be either one. I've always had dogs as companions (I say companions because we've never had a pet that stayed with us for a long time that we didn't feel a connection with ((we being my dad brother and I)) we all had to agree that they were a good animal and then we wouldn't name them for several days to first see what they were like...)

Lions, i've just loved them...Same with Wolves.


I think Loyalty is extremely important, your family should come before everything. Your mate should be important as well. I dunno, there's a lot more I could say, but i'm going ot leave it alone for now

Why is there an assumption that these are deities? Why would there be an assumption that there is anything beyond a personal affinity for such?  

[Adametokillfor]

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TeaDidikai

Kitera-the-Red-Mage

A dual set of deities...

This makes a good start to understanding different concepts of deities. Which one suits your understanding?

Hard polytheism would be the best explanation. I don't pretend to fully understand them and who they are, because i'm still getting to know them. A female deity has been who i'm getting to know better through my meditations.

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I believe in reincarnation.

What purpose does it serve? Is there ever an end to the cycle? What is your understanding of other's interactions with "ghosts"?

For me, I think that there is an end to the cycle. I've thought about this for a long time. I think that there is an amount of time after you die, perhaps depending on how you live i dunno for sure, that you're left on earth. You have to find your way back. If that makes sense? I'm not the best at explaining it on...computer.

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Not fully sure about magic and such, I see it more as something that allows you to be receptive to things rather than making them happen.

How do you define magic? What does your understanding say about other's definitions?

My defininition is using something, a chant a prayer whatever, and causing something else to happen. I think that if someone else wants to practice it, it's fine, but I don't personally fully believe in it. I think rituals and such and make you more receptive to certain things, but I do not think that they automatically make them happen.

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I think love spells are bull and people shouldn't use them.

If they are "bull" why would it matter if someone used them? What about the people who are in happy long term relationships because of them? What element of their dynamic makes them improper to use?

Like I said above, I think the love spells that "make" someone fall in love with you is silly, i should have restated that, but if it's something that just caused both of you to be more receptive to the person you were meant to be with, that's fine. And i've been around a lot of people, stupid teen friends mostly, who "use" them to "make" someone fall for them.

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I believe in the Fates, have for years.

As in the Hellenic Fates? Or some other tradition that is equivocated with them?

I'm not sure exactly, probably Hellenic would be the one to describe them best. They are what causes things to happen in life depending on how we act. In cards, the Fates are either with you or not and there isn't much that can change that. There are a few other things like that but I can't think of them right now.

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Kitera-the-Red-Mage

One other thing: I'm wondering if there are any Gods who exclusively come to people in animal forms?

If I had to say two animals that i have been extremely close to since I was a small child i'd say a Dog and a Lion.

For the first five years of my life I pretended to be either one. I've always had dogs as companions (I say companions because we've never had a pet that stayed with us for a long time that we didn't feel a connection with ((we being my dad brother and I)) we all had to agree that they were a good animal and then we wouldn't name them for several days to first see what they were like...)

Lions, i've just loved them...Same with Wolves.


I think Loyalty is extremely important, your family should come before everything. Your mate should be important as well. I dunno, there's a lot more I could say, but i'm going ot leave it alone for now

Why is there an assumption that these are deities? Why would there be an assumption that there is anything beyond a personal affinity for such?

Dunno, i was just asking because that may or may not help me on my way to finding more out about myself. I dunno...I think they are just something that I show respect for.... sweatdrop  

[TeaDidikai]

Kitera-the-Red-Mage

Hard polytheism would be the best explanation. I don't pretend to fully understand them and who they are, because i'm still getting to know them. A female deity has been who i'm getting to know better through my meditations.

Have you asked her who she is?

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For me, I think that there is an end to the cycle. I've thought about this for a long time. I think that there is an amount of time after you die, perhaps depending on how you live i dunno for sure, that you're left on earth. You have to find your way back. If that makes sense? I'm not the best at explaining it on...computer.

No worries. So, depending on how you live your life, you get sent back to earth until you erode the essence that keeps you incarnating?

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My defininition is using something, a chant a prayer whatever, and causing something else to happen. I think that if someone else wants to practice it, it's fine, but I don't personally fully believe in it.

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If you don't believe in it, how do you know you are accurately defining it? If someone uses "something", such as their hand, to turn on a light switch, thus causing something else to happen- is that magic?

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I think rituals and such and make you more receptive to certain things, but I do not think that they automatically make them happen.

What qualifies something as "automatic"? Is that "without fail"? Is there a time limit? Is it a function of the person's ability to fulfill the outlines of what the magic requires properly?

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Like I said above, I think the love spells that "make" someone fall in love with you is silly,

Why is it silly?

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i should have restated that, but if it's something that just caused both of you to be more receptive to the person you were meant to be with, that's fine. And i've been around a lot of people, stupid teen friends mostly, who "use" them to "make" someone fall for them.

I'm still not seeing a clear explanation as to what makes this bad. Could you explain further?

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I'm not sure exactly, probably Hellenic would be the one to describe them best. They are what causes things to happen in life depending on how we act. In cards, the Fates are either with you or not and there isn't much that can change that. There are a few other things like that but I can't think of them right now.

I'm a little confused, you said that they change based on how we act, but that there isn't anything we can really do to put them on our side. This seems like a contradiction- could you explain it further?

Can gods change the fate of man?

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Dunno, i was just asking because that may or may not help me on my way to finding more out about myself. I dunno...I think they are just something that I show respect for.... sweatdrop

Do they have to be deities for you to respect them? This is going to come across a bit harsh, but what elements of an animal that eats it's own poop deserves respect? What elements of a lion's behavior warrants adoration?

 

[Adametokillfor]

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TeaDidikai

Kitera-the-Red-Mage

Hard polytheism would be the best explanation. I don't pretend to fully understand them and who they are, because i'm still getting to know them. A female deity has been who i'm getting to know better through my meditations.

Have you asked her who she is?

Not yet...I'm not yet fully into my meditations yet, i'm still learning how to get into the right state and all that. Thus far I've seen her sitting under a willow watching down at the sea. Then she was walking down a hill, the main thing that stood out was that every step she took green things, like grass and vines and flowers, grew around her foot but died away as her foot moved away.

As I said before, I don't know her fully yet, and i'm letting this take its time so that I can get ot know her right and don't name her wrong and upset her.

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For me, I think that there is an end to the cycle. I've thought about this for a long time. I think that there is an amount of time after you die, perhaps depending on how you live i dunno for sure, that you're left on earth. You have to find your way back. If that makes sense? I'm not the best at explaining it on...computer.

No worries. So, depending on how you live your life, you get sent back to earth until you erode the essence that keeps you incarnating?

Something like that. You have a lesson in every life to learn and once you've learned all the lessons there are you get your eternity.

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My defininition is using something, a chant a prayer whatever, and causing something else to happen. I think that if someone else wants to practice it, it's fine, but I don't personally fully believe in it.

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If you don't believe in it, how do you know you are accurately defining it? If someone uses "something", such as their hand, to turn on a light switch, thus causing something else to happen- is that magic?

Basically I don't believe that by saying a spell I can make things happen. It can make things more likely to happen. Like you say a spell that would help you finacially...It's not going to make a wad of cash appear, but it will make you more receptive to financial benefits.

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I think rituals and such and make you more receptive to certain things, but I do not think that they automatically make them happen.

What qualifies something as "automatic"? Is that "without fail"? Is there a time limit? Is it a function of the person's ability to fulfill the outlines of what the magic requires properly?

Automatic in the sense like my friends think if they do a love spell they can make a guy automatically fall madly in love with them and be at their command.

And on the receptive thing, it would be that in the upcoming weeks you'd be more receptive to ______ gains. See my money example above

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Like I said above, I think the love spells that "make" someone fall in love with you is silly,

Why is it silly?

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i should have restated that, but if it's something that just caused both of you to be more receptive to the person you were meant to be with, that's fine. And i've been around a lot of people, stupid teen friends mostly, who "use" them to "make" someone fall for them.

I'm still not seeing a clear explanation as to what makes this bad. Could you explain further?

Just in the sense that it is forcing an emotion on someone, sorry this is more towards my teen friends who pretend to hex people for shits and giggles, Meaning like "I cast this spell and he will fall madly in love with me and do whatever I want"

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I'm not sure exactly, probably Hellenic would be the one to describe them best. They are what causes things to happen in life depending on how we act. In cards, the Fates are either with you or not and there isn't much that can change that. There are a few other things like that but I can't think of them right now.

I'm a little confused, you said that they change based on how we act, but that there isn't anything we can really do to put them on our side. This seems like a contradiction- could you explain it further?Can gods change the fate of man?

Okays, and sorry in advanced for being unclear i'm kinda jumpy around on subjects, but the Fates are not just like three people. They're like a spirit. You do something that pleases them and good things happen, and vice versa. They can be apeased through any sort of way. I think that people have a destiny, like something their meant to do (See the reincarnation thingy I have up above) and depending on how you've pleased the Fates depends on how hard or easy that journey is. Gods can intervene on behalf of man but don't often. sweatdrop I don't know how much sense that makes, but it's hard for me to explain the Fates, they're something i've believed in since I was a little kid.

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Dunno, i was just asking because that may or may not help me on my way to finding more out about myself. I dunno...I think they are just something that I show respect for.... sweatdrop

Do they have to be deities for you to respect them? This is going to come across a bit harsh, but what elements of an animal that eats it's own poop deserves respect? What elements of a lion's behavior warrants adoration?

Well for me it's just some of their aspects, Pack loyalty, things like that. I dunno really, but both have always been special to me, maybe not deitiy status, i think I was reaching there, but definately respect.

 

[maenad nuri]

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Okays, and sorry in advanced for being unclear i'm kinda jumpy around on subjects, but the Fates are not just like three people. They're like a spirit. You do something that pleases them and good things happen, and vice versa. They can be apeased through any sort of way. I think that people have a destiny, like something their meant to do (See the reincarnation thingy I have up above) and depending on how you've pleased the Fates depends on how hard or easy that journey is. Gods can intervene on behalf of man but don't often. icon_sweatdrop.gif I don't know how much sense that makes, but it's hard for me to explain the Fates, they're something i've believed in since I was a little kid.

There is very little appeasing Fate to make things easier. Sounds to me like you are mixing Tykhe in there as well, the goddess of Good Fortune. She is identified with them, but usually as a separate goddess.  

[Adametokillfor]

Nuri

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Okays, and sorry in advanced for being unclear i'm kinda jumpy around on subjects, but the Fates are not just like three people. They're like a spirit. You do something that pleases them and good things happen, and vice versa. They can be apeased through any sort of way. I think that people have a destiny, like something their meant to do (See the reincarnation thingy I have up above) and depending on how you've pleased the Fates depends on how hard or easy that journey is. Gods can intervene on behalf of man but don't often. icon_sweatdrop.gif I don't know how much sense that makes, but it's hard for me to explain the Fates, they're something i've believed in since I was a little kid.

There is very little appeasing Fate to make things easier. Sounds to me like you are mixing Tykhe in there as well, the goddess of Good Fortune. She is identified with them, but usually as a separate goddess.

Ahhhh...That makes sense. I've just always tried to make the Fates happy...Hmmm I'm not sure, I think that Karma might play in a bit, but I don't fully 100% understand Karma so i'm not gonna call it that. Just basically if you do good things, good things happen.  

[maenad nuri]

Kitera-the-Red-Mage

Nuri

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Okays, and sorry in advanced for being unclear i'm kinda jumpy around on subjects, but the Fates are not just like three people. They're like a spirit. You do something that pleases them and good things happen, and vice versa. They can be apeased through any sort of way. I think that people have a destiny, like something their meant to do (See the reincarnation thingy I have up above) and depending on how you've pleased the Fates depends on how hard or easy that journey is. Gods can intervene on behalf of man but don't often. icon_sweatdrop.gif I don't know how much sense that makes, but it's hard for me to explain the Fates, they're something i've believed in since I was a little kid.

There is very little appeasing Fate to make things easier. Sounds to me like you are mixing Tykhe in there as well, the goddess of Good Fortune. She is identified with them, but usually as a separate goddess.

Ahhhh...That makes sense. I've just always tried to make the Fates happy...Hmmm I'm not sure, I think that Karma might play in a bit, but I don't fully 100% understand Karma so i'm not gonna call it that. Just basically if you do good things, good things happen.

It's a good thing you aren't calling that Karma, because that isn't what karma is.  

[Adametokillfor]

Nuri

Kitera-the-Red-Mage

Nuri

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Okays, and sorry in advanced for being unclear i'm kinda jumpy around on subjects, but the Fates are not just like three people. They're like a spirit. You do something that pleases them and good things happen, and vice versa. They can be apeased through any sort of way. I think that people have a destiny, like something their meant to do (See the reincarnation thingy I have up above) and depending on how you've pleased the Fates depends on how hard or easy that journey is. Gods can intervene on behalf of man but don't often. icon_sweatdrop.gif I don't know how much sense that makes, but it's hard for me to explain the Fates, they're something i've believed in since I was a little kid.

There is very little appeasing Fate to make things easier. Sounds to me like you are mixing Tykhe in there as well, the goddess of Good Fortune. She is identified with them, but usually as a separate goddess.

Ahhhh...That makes sense. I've just always tried to make the Fates happy...Hmmm I'm not sure, I think that Karma might play in a bit, but I don't fully 100% understand Karma so i'm not gonna call it that. Just basically if you do good things, good things happen.

It's a good thing you aren't calling that Karma, because that isn't what karma is.

Ah, see that's why I try not to call stuff anything till i'm sure what is.

...btw what is Karma really? neutral I only have the americanized *Cough*stupidfriends*cough* version of what Karma is...I've started to ignore my friends a long time ago but stilll.....  

[TeaDidikai]

Karma is a concept that formed in Hinduism.

In short, it is the accumulated measure of actions that go against your Dharma.

Dharma is what you are. When you contradict your nature with your actions, you gain Karma which keeps you in the cycle of reincarnation. At times your Dharma conflicts with itself, and thus no matter what you do, you gain Karma.  

[Adametokillfor]

TeaDidikai

Karma is a concept that formed in Hinduism.

In short, it is the accumulated measure of actions that go against your Dharma.

Dharma is what you are. When you contradict your nature with your actions, you gain Karma which keeps you in the cycle of reincarnation. At times your Dharma conflicts with itself, and thus no matter what you do, you gain Karma.

Ohhhhhh! biggrin Thank you for lessening my ignorance.  

[Maze]

TeaDidikai

Karma is a concept that formed in Hinduism.

In short, it is the accumulated measure of actions that go against your Dharma.

Dharma is what you are. When you contradict your nature with your actions, you gain Karma which keeps you in the cycle of reincarnation. At times your Dharma conflicts with itself, and thus no matter what you do, you gain Karma.

Does that mean that following one's dharma equals stagnation?  

[TeaDidikai]

Maze

TeaDidikai

Karma is a concept that formed in Hinduism.

In short, it is the accumulated measure of actions that go against your Dharma.

Dharma is what you are. When you contradict your nature with your actions, you gain Karma which keeps you in the cycle of reincarnation. At times your Dharma conflicts with itself, and thus no matter what you do, you gain Karma.

Does that mean that following one's dharma equals stagnation?

What is your concept of "stagnation"?