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A question of a Heraldic nature.

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Sir_Catherine

Paladin Knight

32,890 Points
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:49 pm
Actualy, two questions.

I realize these topics are rather off the beaten path, so I'll explain. I am part of an organization known as the Society of Creative Anachronism. We study the middle ages. SCA.org will fill you in quickly and easily.

Heraldry, obviously, was a part of these times. I've discovered a deep interest in heraldry through the SCA and, much to my pleasure, our organization's rules of heraldry are based on the rules of English heraldry. We can apply for arms within our society, hence the need for a set of rules in the first place.

In the end, this has engendered a question that while seemingly completly irrelevent, actualy does have importance.

Do you know what a baldric is? I ask because knowing is necessary to answer my question at all.
Assuming now that you do, from which shoulder to which hip does a knight wear a baldric? I am aware that a baldric is not present in the official uniform of all chivalric orders, but I ask this question of those that do.
Can someone tell me exactly what orders use the baldirc, as well as which shoulder to hip direction is used?

My second question is one that may not have an answer. I recognize that men who have been knighted are termed 'Sir' and the general term for a woman knighted is either 'Dame' or 'Lady', depending upon the chivalric order she has been inducted into.

Are there any chivalric orders in which a woman would also be termed 'Sir' or given that option?

I appreciate any help a person might offer with these technical questions.

As a note; I have found the website for the English College of Heralds and in the end just might pose my questions to them, but it would be greatly appreciated if someone here could help me out.

Thank you.
 
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 1:37 am
I know what a baldric is, more-or-less. However where it is involved in the ceremonial wear of a modern knight it is, so far as I can tell from memory, renamed a sash. Which may be why you're having difficulty hunting for informations about baldrics, that and Blackadder.

As regards wearing a sash, this confuses me too. Royals always seem to have it on the left shoulder, and most others having it on the right. The right makes more snese, in my view, but I've no idea how it ties in with different orders, alas.
 

Invictus_88
Captain


Emmanuela

PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 3:44 am
I don't know about the Baldric thing (I thought it was going to be a Black Adder reference..) but I think that you can't have a woman who's a sir because "sir" is a masculine title and only men can be called that. It's like you wouldn't call a man "lady", would you? The title depends on the sex even though they're of equal rank, if you get what I mean.

((Hah, my boyfriend gets a title when he's older, so he'll be a sirXD Ghaha... ))  
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 10:42 am
Invictus_88
I know what a baldric is, more-or-less. However where it is involved in the ceremonial wear of a modern knight it is, so far as I can tell from memory, renamed a sash. Which may be why you're having difficulty hunting for informations about baldrics, that and Blackadder.

As regards wearing a sash, this confuses me too. Royals always seem to have it on the left shoulder, and most others having it on the right. The right makes more snese, in my view, but I've no idea how it ties in with different orders, alas.


So glad someone else has noticed the Royal/left others/right tendency. It was/is driving me a bit crazy because it leaves open the question of 'why'. Furthermore, correct me if I'm wrong, but Her Magesty is, as the fount of honor, the technical head of all chivalric orders. This and the lack of photoes of modern knights in ceremonial wear has had me thinking that perhaps the sash is worn as Her Magisty is shown wearing it. I'd like to find out /for sure/ why she wears a sash, it could be something unrelated to the chivalric orders, but no luck there so far. I think the medals on her sash are of the orders she is head of, but I'd have to confirm that. To top it all off, I found a picture yesterday of the 'Military Knights of Windsor' wearing sashes from right shoulder to left hip. They are not the actual Garter Knights though, so that doesn't confirm anything one way or another, even for that specific order. This is going to be an even greater headache if each order has the choice of how to wear the sash.  

Sir_Catherine

Paladin Knight

32,890 Points
  • Battle: Knight 100
  • Survivor 150
  • Tested Practitioner 250

wodewose

PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 2:55 pm
Originaly a Baldric was a leather sword belt worn slung over the shoulder...It denoted Military rank or nobility (although how I have no idea).It was in later years it became the ornamental sash-type thing.The interestingthing about them is A: due to the fact that the weight of the item carried was spread about the shoulder a far longer/heavier weapon could be carried (Claymore for example) and B: they later became popular for carrying powderhorns.

source : a Friend in the Sealed Knot (A Royalist..natrually)  
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