Worship Out of Force

[MST3Kakalina]

Is it possible to forge a meaningful relationship with a deity, even if you didn't originally feel ANY draw towards them whatsoever? I'm talking about hypothetical situations like:

*randomly picking a deity and then consciously making an effort to worship it. I know you could say that there's no such thing as "randomness" and that you picked the deity for a reason, but let's just assume, for sake of discussion, that it was purely random with no supernatural influence.

*being forced into the worship of a deity by an outside, mundane force (as opposed to Odin going "hey. YOU. NOW."). Think of old Christian (I think Islamic, as well) "convert or die" campaigns.

*etc

I dunno what I think, yet. I'm curious to see what everyone else has to say.  

[TeaDidikai]

MST3Kakalina

Is it possible to forge a meaningful relationship with a deity, even if you didn't originally feel ANY draw towards them whatsoever? I'm talking about hypothetical situations like:

*randomly picking a deity and then consciously making an effort to worship it. I know you could say that there's no such thing as "randomness" and that you picked the deity for a reason, but let's just assume, for sake of discussion, that it was purely random with no supernatural influence.

I think if you beat on a god's door long enough, you'll be able to establish a relationship with them.

I personally wouldn't want to do that however.

Quote:

*being forced into the worship of a deity by an outside, mundane force (as opposed to Odin going "hey. YOU. NOW."). Think of old Christian (I think Islamic, as well) "convert or die" campaigns.

*etc

I dunno what I think, yet. I'm curious to see what everyone else has to say.

I think it is possible to be forced to worship one way, but have your faith be different. I also think that in such situations, while the god the individuals are forcing you to work with may not be the one who owns you, that the other god may speak in subtle ways through another's symbolism.

For example, I have a friend who was forced to attend Catholic Mass and was pretty much told it didn't matter who or what she believed in, that she was going to be Catholic or she was going to be beaten, or lose her Children.

She complied. Eventually she built a small alter to a Saint she picked at random. (I think it was one of the Michaels), and slowly she began to see symbols that she was well aquainted with from her former belief system work their way into the very Catholic practices- but with a deeply spiritual to them.

Through her personal experiences she began to see her god on the alter, not the Saint. ~shurgs~ But that is just one individuals experience.  

[blindfaith^_^]

I think it all depends on circumstances. If, for example, one didn't know what deity to follow and decided to close his or her eyes and pick a name from a list. Then this person could learn about the deity and slowly create a relationship.

In a "worship or die situation", if the person already has a set system of beliefs, he or she might go through the motions, but I don't think they will ever believe. There is a high probablity that the person will sneak symbols and thoughts of their intial religon into their new worship. They will warp their worship into a paturn as similar as they can get to what they orginally believed.

Again, if the God of system that was being forced upon them seemed to align well with what they had before it might be easy or insignificant change that a person doesn't mind or notice. Of course this is less true in imposed deity worship as it is in the difference between being Catholic and Protestant, where the god is the same and some of the traditions are different.  

[Padmasana]

blindfaith^_^

There is a high probablity that the person will sneak symbols and thoughts of their intial religon into their new worship. They will warp their worship into a paturn as similar as they can get to what they orginally believed.

Is Santeria a valid example of this?  

[blindfaith^_^]

Padmasana

blindfaith^_^

There is a high probablity that the person will sneak symbols and thoughts of their intial religon into their new worship. They will warp their worship into a paturn as similar as they can get to what they orginally believed.

Is Santeria a valid example of this?

I'm not really sure, mostly because I don't know what Santeria is. ::rushes to google to find out::

Edit: I think that's a really good example, and interesting too. Thanks for pointing it out.  

[Arichan16]

It's my personal belief that nothing should ever be forced. If you don't feel a draw to a deity, then maybe you shouldn't focus on choosing a deity. maybe you should focus on knowing yourself more before you go trying to cling to something else. When it comes to you, it comes to you. I think that forcing religion is wrong, no matter what part of any religion happens to be in discussion. Is it possible to forge a meaningful relationship? Maybe... but I would rather not find out the hard way.  

[Memento Mortalis Es]

The first situation is impossible. Anytime you try to choose a deity randomly, the deity you end up choosing has meaning.

And nobody ever builds a relationship with a deity that they were forced to worship by other mortals. There is no divine version of Stockholm Syndrome.  

[MST3Kakalina]

Bite the Wax Tadpole

The first situation is impossible. Anytime you try to choose a deity randomly, the deity you end up choosing has meaning.

Well, consdering that for the sake of example I was talking purely random, with no meaning whatsoever, this isn't really the kind of answer I was looking for.

I've been thinking about this, I saw that first scenario as something like an arranged marriage: there isn't necessarily an attraction or a choosing involved, but over time a caring, meaningful relationship can evolve out of it.

I don't quite know about the second scenario, though. It seems the popular thing is simply to combine the old and the new in a way that keeps you alive.

I have yet to feel particularly called or attracted to any deity, which is part of the reason why I asked. I'm beginning to wonder if picking at random (and then properly researching!) would be the way to go about things--perhaps from there I will be springboarded into other deities?  

[Memento Mortalis Es]

Try searching through a compendium of sorts for Pagan deities. Start anywhere--beginning, end, middle, doesn't matter--and keep going until something clicks. Or picking randomly could work, because meaning would be inevitable.

Honestly, if you wanted help finding a deity, you should have just asked instead of circuitously perambulating your way to the question.

Combining the old ways with the new does often work, but that's not what I thought you were talking about.  

[AingealOreiad]

MST3Kakalina

I have yet to feel particularly called or attracted to any deity, which is part of the reason why I asked. I'm beginning to wonder if picking at random (and then properly researching!) would be the way to go about things--perhaps from there I will be springboarded into other deities?

Why do you *need* a deity? I know many pagans (myself included) that don't have a patron or favorite deity. Hell, it took me 12 years of being pagan before I began strictly worshiping the Greek gods. Research the gods of various cultures, particularly the cultures that you particularly like. Don't worry about it, too many people are so focused on getting "THEIR" deity that they forget about all the other gods that are out there.  

[MST3Kakalina]

Bite the Wax Tadpole

Try searching through a compendium of sorts for Pagan deities. Start anywhere--beginning, end, middle, doesn't matter--and keep going until something clicks. Or picking randomly could work, because meaning would be inevitable.

Honestly, if you wanted help finding a deity, you should have just asked instead of circuitously perambulating your way to the question.

Combining the old ways with the new does often work, but that's not what I thought you were talking about.

I said it was PART of the reason why I asked. Not the whole reason. A lot of it is just reflection on this hypothetical situation and seeing what other people think.

@Aingeal: I don't mean to derail the thread and make it about MY issue (though I guess I've already done that inadvertantly), but I don't want you to think that I'm ignoring your point. Suffice it to say that it would be easier for me to serve a specific personality than a vague amorphous divine blob.