James 4:13-15

[CrystalMind]

So, as I was searching through my Bible this morning I came across the following passage.

James 4:13-15 KJV

13Go to now, ye that say, To day or to morrow we will go into such a city, and continue there a year, and buy and sell, and get gain:

14Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away.

15For that ye ought to say, If the Lord will, we shall live, and do this, or that.

It got me thinking about how we are always planning for the future; always worrying about tomorrow. Basically, the message I'm getting from this passage is "Don't worry about tomorrow. It's all in God's hands. Let Him decide what's to be done with your life." At the same time, though, verse 15 seems to imply a need for some kind of readiness, deferred though it may be to the Lord's will.

Discuss:

• How do you interpret the quoted passage?
  
• Do you think we focus too much on the future?
  
• To what extent do you think we should plan out future events?

 

[Jessy_4 26 2008]

How do you interpret the quoted passage?
To me it seems like, we can make a lot of plans, but that tomorrow is ethereal, we don't know what will happen, what events will occur that will change our schedule, but God does, and we should trust in Him. No matter what plans you have, God's plans supersede.

Do you think we focus too much on the future?
Yes, I do actually. A few years ago I would've said that no one can ever focus on the future too much, but a few years ago I was quite a different person. Everything we do our whole lives is for our future, we go to school and learn what people think we should know for our future, when you're in school the most common question is "what do you want to do when you grow up? what do you want to have?", in relationships we focus on our future as a couple, we spend and save according to our future plans. Even when you're out of school and start working, you start planning for old age. When you're old, you start planning for your end.

We need to slow down, and focus on the problems we have to do. Our lives are so FAST, we do everything all the time, we don't slow down and smell the roses. It's quick pleasures, everything timed, exactly 15 minutes here, 8 hours there, 6 hours of sleep, we try to get where we want to go as fast as we can, and we try to speed things up as much as we can. When you slow down, you can see your impact instead of just seeing where you've gotten to. We need to trust God with the future, and focus on matters of the present. Sometimes, a lot of times, people are going so fast that they can't even remember what they were doing the next day. Life is quick enough, why only see the years ahead and not what's around you?

To what extent do you think we should plan out future events?
I think that we should set things roughly in place, but be open to God's plans. Make sure we allow for other things to happen, not jam pack our schedule to where being 15 minutes or so late would be catastrophic. We should save some, but not just for retirement, or college. We should save in case there are people we need to help financially as well, and so we can help others. We should plan to where we aren't foolish. You can't expect to do nothing and have food drop in your lap and all your bills paid. You have to plan to where you can get a good job, make sure you have time for things related to that work, and time to just relax and enjoy life. You can't say, right this minute, what you'll be and who you'll be when you're 50. It's alright to roughly plan a few years ahead so that graduating from high school isn't a shock, or beginning a career or a family isn't a problem. But you can't plan your whole life minute by minute.  

[Priestley]

• How do you interpret the quoted passage?

I interpret that passage as a warning to those who go about their business according to their best laid plans whilst being completely unprepared for changes in circumstances.

There is the idea that things that happen beyond our control, things beyond what we can take into account when making our plans, are under God's authority. So, in being willing to accept that authority, one prepares oneself for the unpredictable.

• Do you think we focus too much on the future?

I think this differs according to each individual. I think a common thread that we all share is that we as people are so bound to the earth and that we busy ourselves with our own lives and the lives of those around us. There are things we want that cannot be gained instantly, so we are forced to be patient and do things according to their time. There are things that need to be done now and things that will need to be done at a later date, when the requirements to do them have been met, and so on.

In contrast, you have Jesus who had a sense of living in the now, in a life of wandering and going wherever the Spirit took him. What happened to him was already planned for him, so this was really the only life he could and would lead. However, because we are so bound to worldly things and it is difficult for us to leave those things behind, we may not live a life comparable to that. Consider how much society today would have a problem with you if you were a drifter and not part of the system.

• To what extent do you think we should plan out future events?

As I said before, it's difficult to live a life of freedom if one is bound to worldly things. However, if you really want to live the life for God and you're able to cast off the things to which you are attached, there really isn't a way to plan for that life because the plans are made for you.

However, I think, if you live a life of responsibility to yourself and to others, planning is a necessary thing. It is best in this case to be cautious not to be so certain of your plans that you will be taken by surprise if circumstances change. Be flexible and aware of your position and of the things happening around you so you can take them into account for the decisions you make going forward.  

[Fushigi na Butterfly]

Jessy_4 26 2008

How do you interpret the quoted passage?
To me it seems like, we can make a lot of plans, but that tomorrow is ethereal, we don't know what will happen, what events will occur that will change our schedule, but God does, and we should trust in Him. No matter what plans you have, God's plans supersede.

Do you think we focus too much on the future?
Yes, I do actually. A few years ago I would've said that no one can ever focus on the future too much, but a few years ago I was quite a different person. Everything we do our whole lives is for our future, we go to school and learn what people think we should know for our future, when you're in school the most common question is "what do you want to do when you grow up? what do you want to have?", in relationships we focus on our future as a couple, we spend and save according to our future plans. Even when you're out of school and start working, you start planning for old age. When you're old, you start planning for your end.

We need to slow down, and focus on the problems we have to do. Our lives are so FAST, we do everything all the time, we don't slow down and smell the roses. It's quick pleasures, everything timed, exactly 15 minutes here, 8 hours there, 6 hours of sleep, we try to get where we want to go as fast as we can, and we try to speed things up as much as we can. When you slow down, you can see your impact instead of just seeing where you've gotten to. We need to trust God with the future, and focus on matters of the present. Sometimes, a lot of times, people are going so fast that they can't even remember what they were doing the next day. Life is quick enough, why only see the years ahead and not what's around you?

To what extent do you think we should plan out future events?
I think that we should set things roughly in place, but be open to God's plans. Make sure we allow for other things to happen, not jam pack our schedule to where being 15 minutes or so late would be catastrophic. We should save some, but not just for retirement, or college. We should save in case there are people we need to help financially as well, and so we can help others. We should plan to where we aren't foolish. You can't expect to do nothing and have food drop in your lap and all your bills paid. You have to plan to where you can get a good job, make sure you have time for things related to that work, and time to just relax and enjoy life. You can't say, right this minute, what you'll be and who you'll be when you're 50. It's alright to roughly plan a few years ahead so that graduating from high school isn't a shock, or beginning a career or a family isn't a problem. But you can't plan your whole life minute by minute.

THIS I have nothing to add. 3nodding  

[nippa!]

In the book of Matthew it consistently says that Jesus was on his way to jerusalem and he goes to one town does healing, gets up and prays in the morning and leaves even after his disciples tell him about all of the sick people in the rtown that want him to heal them. Jesus had a lot of expectations of him and yet he kept himself focused on his end goal - Jerusalem. Most of his ministry took place on his journey to Jerusalem. Jesus had a final goal, it was God's final goal for him and Jesus kept himself focused on this. It would have been so easy for Jesus to stay in the towns and heal more people but he kept moving.

This for me suggests that God wants us to keep our focus on who is in charge. It is so easy to get wrapped up in the things around us that we forget to keep him and his mission for us at our focus (even if were not sure yet what he wants us specifically to do).

The people in the passage were taking their lives for granted and were not living for today. Jesus lived each day for it's own. We must live like today is our last day, showing God's mercy, without worry for what we will eat and not spend our entire time storing up riches that we may not be alive for tomorrow. We should pray and ask for God's guidance in our plans and be open to his way with our livs, make sure their is rooom for him.

I think.
I borrowed the first bit from:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KJ4p_mfi18
but i reworded it. Nooma is really good.  

[CrystalMind]

That's great, nippa. Priestley, Jessy, thank you for your input as well.

The more that we focus on worldly things, the more that they seem to race away from us, and we-- like the sheep we are --chase after them. God is the ultimate authority. Isn't it kind of a slap in the face to be planning out our lives without any regard to His will?  

[Priestley]

CrystalMind

That's great, nippa. Priestley, Jessy, thank you for your input as well.

The more that we focus on worldly things, the more that they seem to race away from us, and we-- like the sheep we are --chase after them. God is the ultimate authority. Isn't it kind of a slap in the face to be planning out our lives without any regard to His will?

You're welcome.

I don't think it is a slap in the face. God's shoulders are broad. He is able to endure a lot of things. I do not believe that God wants us to live a life where we let all manner of things happen to us without objection. There are some occasions where we are forced to face the challenges in our way because we can go no further unless we do. Even Jesus was challenged by circumstances from the moment he set out on his mission. He spoke up and answered those challenges. It is only when he was facing trial in Jerusalem that he kept quiet, because there is a time for speaking and a time for silence.  

[mangachan]

How do you interpret the quoted passage?
We don't know what or where we will be doing down the road. We arenn't the author/finsher of our fates, God is. We aren't even promised tommorrow, we aren't even entitled to be alive right now. Also, in that last verse it's saying that we we should always consider what God wants for us by saying "if the Lord will." My parents always say that and it used to irriate me but now it makes perfect sense.


Do you think we focus too much on the future?
Yes. This is the reason I have alot of problems in my life now. People think alot about the future but often fail to take God into consideration. I made this mistake and it's disobeidence plain and simple...it is considered pride and is a sin. When I was in middle school and high school I was convinced by my family, teachers, classmates, and myself that I should get into the medical field. I had my life mapped out from ages 14-26. I was so sure I was going to vet school and if that didn't work out I would at least have some fancy little medical job. I never once stopped to pray about it or seek God's guidence yet I listened to everybody else. Long story short, I suck at math and science so I'm switching to art. I've been praying about it and God is pulling me in that direction. I don't know where exactly I'll end up but it's all about trusting God and of course putting forth the effort to get through it all.


To what extent do you think we should plan out future events?
Like I said before, it's okay to make sure you won't be out on the streets and you do what you need to do in order to fufill His purpose for your life but always always ALWAYS seek God whenever you do anything. It doesn't matter how big or small it seems because everything we do should be for the glory of God. If you are doing something and he's telling you to go somewhere else listen and do it right then! You might miss your blessing.  

[mangachan]

Priestley

CrystalMind

That's great, nippa. Priestley, Jessy, thank you for your input as well.

The more that we focus on worldly things, the more that they seem to race away from us, and we-- like the sheep we are --chase after them. God is the ultimate authority. Isn't it kind of a slap in the face to be planning out our lives without any regard to His will?

You're welcome.

I don't think it is a slap in the face. God's shoulders are broad. He is able to endure a lot of things. I do not believe that God wants us to live a life where we let all manner of things happen to us without objection. There are some occasions where we are forced to face the challenges in our way because we can go no further unless we do. Even Jesus was challenged by circumstances from the moment he set out on his mission. He spoke up and answered those challenges. It is only when he was facing trial in Jerusalem that he kept quiet, because there is a time for speaking and a time for silence.

I disagree with this. Alot of the reason why I disagree is in my first post. It is a complete and total disgregard for God and a challenge to His power. That is pride which the bible says is an abomination. I have that verse somewhere, I'll update this post when I find it (I think it's in proverbs?). I don't think He expects us to live without obstacles either but that doesn't mean He thinks it's okay to completely ignore Him. Besides, why wouldn't you want an all knowing and all powerful being to help you out? wink  

[Priestley]

mangachan

Priestley

CrystalMind

That's great, nippa. Priestley, Jessy, thank you for your input as well.

The more that we focus on worldly things, the more that they seem to race away from us, and we-- like the sheep we are --chase after them. God is the ultimate authority. Isn't it kind of a slap in the face to be planning out our lives without any regard to His will?

You're welcome.

I don't think it is a slap in the face. God's shoulders are broad. He is able to endure a lot of things. I do not believe that God wants us to live a life where we let all manner of things happen to us without objection. There are some occasions where we are forced to face the challenges in our way because we can go no further unless we do. Even Jesus was challenged by circumstances from the moment he set out on his mission. He spoke up and answered those challenges. It is only when he was facing trial in Jerusalem that he kept quiet, because there is a time for speaking and a time for silence.

I disagree with this. Alot of the reason why I disagree is in my first post. It is a complete and total disgregard for God and a challenge to His power. That is pride which the bible says is an abomination. I have that verse somewhere, I'll update this post when I find it (I think it's in proverbs?). I don't think He expects us to live without obstacles either but that doesn't mean He thinks it's okay to completely ignore Him. Besides, why wouldn't you want an all knowing and all powerful being to help you out? wink

I'll ask you the same question that I asked you elsewhere. Do you make decisions for yourself?  

[mangachan]

Priestley

mangachan

Priestley

CrystalMind

That's great, nippa. Priestley, Jessy, thank you for your input as well.

The more that we focus on worldly things, the more that they seem to race away from us, and we-- like the sheep we are --chase after them. God is the ultimate authority. Isn't it kind of a slap in the face to be planning out our lives without any regard to His will?

You're welcome.

I don't think it is a slap in the face. God's shoulders are broad. He is able to endure a lot of things. I do not believe that God wants us to live a life where we let all manner of things happen to us without objection. There are some occasions where we are forced to face the challenges in our way because we can go no further unless we do. Even Jesus was challenged by circumstances from the moment he set out on his mission. He spoke up and answered those challenges. It is only when he was facing trial in Jerusalem that he kept quiet, because there is a time for speaking and a time for silence.

I disagree with this. Alot of the reason why I disagree is in my first post. It is a complete and total disgregard for God and a challenge to His power. That is pride which the bible says is an abomination. I have that verse somewhere, I'll update this post when I find it (I think it's in proverbs?). I don't think He expects us to live without obstacles either but that doesn't mean He thinks it's okay to completely ignore Him. Besides, why wouldn't you want an all knowing and all powerful being to help you out? wink

I'll ask you the same question that I asked you elsewhere. Do you make decisions for yourself?

I'm not going to sugar coat this. I try not to make decisions without praying about it or asking God for guidance anymore. Even if it's a quick "God let me know what I should do" or "God if it's your will open these doors so this can happen" type thing. Now in the meantime I am actually living my life and exerting effort to acheive things. Faith without works is dead afterall.lol

Scriptures relevant to this topic:
Proverbs 13: 18
Poverty and shame shall be to him that refuseth instruction: but he that regardeth reproof shall be honored

Proverbs 15:5
A fool despiseth his father's instruction: but he that regardeth reproof is prudent
In other words, take advice.

Proverbs 3:5-7
Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not to thine own understanding. In all they ways acknowledge him and he shall direct thy paths. Be not wise in thine own eyes:fear the lord and depart from evil.

Listen to God, people sent by him (careful with this one), and any situations that he allows to happen to give you a wakeup call. He knows what's best, we don't b/c we're not perfect.

God being the omnipotent being he is can use this handy ability to get us out of anything. He is here to help, why not use it? God is in control so trust him:
Psalms 31:14-15
But I trusted in thee, O Lord:I said, Thou art my God. My times are in thy hand:deliver me from the hands of my enemies, and from them that persecute me

*I'll just post verses on these next ones. My sister needs me to get off her computer*
Psalms 91:1-7

Ever heard of the saying "let go and let God"? I've learned to live by that which = alot less stress and here are a few scriptures that deal with that.
I Peter 5:6-7
This one is umm... interesting. I have to type this one out:
Luke 6:46
And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
I works well in this context. Why bother even being a Christian if you're going to disregard what God is telling you to do?

God's will:
Matthew 7:21-22
Again, just saying you're Christain isn't good enough. You have to actually do what he wants you to do.  

[Priestley]

mangachan

Priestley

mangachan

Priestley

CrystalMind

That's great, nippa. Priestley, Jessy, thank you for your input as well.

The more that we focus on worldly things, the more that they seem to race away from us, and we-- like the sheep we are --chase after them. God is the ultimate authority. Isn't it kind of a slap in the face to be planning out our lives without any regard to His will?

You're welcome.

I don't think it is a slap in the face. God's shoulders are broad. He is able to endure a lot of things. I do not believe that God wants us to live a life where we let all manner of things happen to us without objection. There are some occasions where we are forced to face the challenges in our way because we can go no further unless we do. Even Jesus was challenged by circumstances from the moment he set out on his mission. He spoke up and answered those challenges. It is only when he was facing trial in Jerusalem that he kept quiet, because there is a time for speaking and a time for silence.

I disagree with this. Alot of the reason why I disagree is in my first post. It is a complete and total disgregard for God and a challenge to His power. That is pride which the bible says is an abomination. I have that verse somewhere, I'll update this post when I find it (I think it's in proverbs?). I don't think He expects us to live without obstacles either but that doesn't mean He thinks it's okay to completely ignore Him. Besides, why wouldn't you want an all knowing and all powerful being to help you out? wink

I'll ask you the same question that I asked you elsewhere. Do you make decisions for yourself?

I'm not going to sugar coat this. I try not to make decisions without praying about it or asking God for guidance anymore. Even if it's a quick "God let me know what I should do" or "God if it's your will open these doors so this can happen" type thing. Now in the meantime I am actually living my life and exerting effort to acheive things. Faith without works is dead afterall.lol

The reason I ask is not to make this personal but is to show that there are tough times when we must rely on our own actions and make our own decisions otherwise nothing will be achieved. To refer to my previous point, there were times when Jesus acted to prevent others exerting their wills over people and times when he did not act to prevent them exerting their wills over him. We must rely on discernment to know when to act and how and to know whether we are being given good or bad advice.

mangachan

Scriptures relevant to this topic:
Proverbs 13: 18
Poverty and shame shall be to him that refuseth instruction: but he that regardeth reproof shall be honored

Proverbs 15:5
A fool despiseth his father's instruction: but he that regardeth reproof is prudent
In other words, take advice.

A more accurate paraphrase would be "do not be ignorant".

mangachan

Proverbs 3:5-7
Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not to thine own understanding. In all they ways acknowledge him and he shall direct thy paths. Be not wise in thine own eyes:fear the lord and depart from evil.

Listen to God, people sent by him (careful with this one), and any situations that he allows to happen to give you a wakeup call. He knows what's best, we don't b/c we're not perfect.

You agree not to underestimate people's ability to exert their wills over others and influence them.

mangachan

Luke 6:46
And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
I works well in this context. Why bother even being a Christian if you're going to disregard what God is telling you to do?

God's will:
Matthew 7:21-22
Again, just saying you're Christain isn't good enough. You have to actually do what he wants you to do.

How do you know what is happening to you is what God wills and not what other people will for you?

For all you know, Jesus could have been referring to his commandments rather than arbitrary feelings of what you feel God is telling you to do in the moment.