Cheesecube wants some honesty!! [Updated 12-24-07]

[.[ Cheesecube ].]

So. I made a thread in the PP asking for some crit/coloring suggestions and all I got was fluff about people liking it. Hearing that is all great and dandy for my confidence, but it sure as hell doesn't improve a piece. So, I decided to start a thread here in which I could feature the current piece I'm working on in hopes of getting help. :3

About Cheese:
I've been drawing nearly my entire life, but didn't really get into it until sixth grade. Now I'm almost positive that I would like to go into art for a living, and I'm trying to improve as much as possible in my last two highschool years. And I know to do that means, pretty much, hating my artwork. Because only when you're disgusted with what you're doing are you pushed to become better. So. I'm looking for some god-honest crit here. If you see something wrong, tell me; But also, try and give me something to help fix it... 'Cause knowing flaws but no way to fix them sucks. : D [I <3 Redlines...]

Currently, I need help on:
http://cheesecube.deviantart.com/art/Pele-72851161

So, I suck at lighting. Majorly. I have no idea where the light should hit, how much should hit, etc. Plus, I'm horrid with traditional media. Any tips?  

[Esper The Phantom Beast]

the girl puppets face looks kinda too masculine for my tastes and the general composition of the face seems off and it seems like all those folds and creases in the dress part are a little to uniform if you know what I mean, seems like some of them should overlap more and have curves to them you had the right idea at the bottom but I would pronounce some of those more and make it look a little more believable. I would also flesh out the stage area more it looks very 2d at the moment like you just slapped a curtain in there and figured we'd imagine the rest in our heads, I know you not finished yet but just saying just in case you know. like there should be a bulge in that curtain where the curtain rod goes across and we should probably be able to see the thickness of the back wall he's leaning on judging by the angel of the floor. Also I think the little puppeteer things are disporportionate but that might just be because you haven't fleshed them out yet, hope that helps maybe. *sighs* I wish some one would post in my form grr lol I feel so lonely.  

[.[ Cheesecube ].]

Exsahn

the girl puppets face looks kinda too masculine for my tastes and the general composition of the face seems off and it seems like all those folds and creases in the dress part are a little to uniform if you know what I mean, seems like some of them should overlap more and have curves to them you had the right idea at the bottom but I would pronounce some of those more and make it look a little more believable. I would also flesh out the stage area more it looks very 2d at the moment like you just slapped a curtain in there and figured we'd imagine the rest in our heads, I know you not finished yet but just saying just in case you know. like there should be a bulge in that curtain where the curtain rod goes across and we should probably be able to see the thickness of the back wall he's leaning on judging by the angel of the floor. Also I think the little puppeteer things are disporportionate but that might just be because you haven't fleshed them out yet, hope that helps maybe. *sighs* I wish some one would post in my form grr lol I feel so lonely.

Any tips/tutorials on how to make the face more feminine or make the dress look natural? I understand what you mean about it looking too uniform, and I agree; I just have a weakness with cloth and don't know how to fix it. Thanks for the tip about the curtain rod; I didn't even think of that!! As far as the wall he's leaning on, I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean, nor how to fix it.. Could you elaborate, please? :3  

[Esper The Phantom Beast]

I'm not sure but check the tutorial thread they might have something in there, but what I'd really recommend is studying real cloth on someone and studying a real women's face at that angle. What my art teacher always recommends is taking a picture of someone in the pose you want with similar clothing and fabric and of course you can always find models online. Even though your working in manga style you should still practice and use reality as a reference. Meh but not everyone likes that answer no matter how true it is so lol I guess you can always wait for someone else to come by and tell you what they think will help. Oh and that back board on the stage even if it is really then judging by the perspective you've got in the picture I should be able to see the ledge of the wall grrr I'm not so good with words I wish I could just whip up an example for you but I don't have a wacom tablet yet.  

[`Famire]

That looks good! I personally don't have a problem with her face but if you did want to make it more feminine, I would suggest making the eyes a little larger and the face a little rounder.
I'm not sure how historically accurate the costumes are, but I'm not sure you're going for accuracy, so I won't say anything about that.
The head of the figure above the curtain is too small, it should be a bit higher. I'd love to redline, but the image is a bit small.
The puppet's skirt could use a little more movement - right now it looks like it's a hoop skirt so it just moves all as one big bulk sort of thing. Is that what you were going for? If not, the skirt should move against the direction she's moving in (if she is moving) and the folds would probably be more curved.  

[Ishrie]

I agree with Famire, I think her face looks fine.

I really like the concept of this piece, and the T-shaped composition. You also did a lovely job on the hands. One thing that bothers me is that the dancing puppets don't seem like they're 'connected'... They're not looking at each other, and the man's hand seems to just disappear behind the woman, so it almost doesn't seem like he's holding her. Maybe you could trace the woman in closer to him?
For the folds, I think that they would look better if you varied them a bit. Right now, they seem pretty uniform-- when fabric's moving all over the place like that, the ruffles aren't all the same lengths and widths.  

[Mogtoats]

To add to the "connection" idea, they're 'squeezing' together, so there should be some deformation. The body is soft....  

[.[ Cheesecube ].]

The Martian

To add to the "connection" idea, they're 'squeezing' together, so there should be some deformation. The body is soft....

Heh, but they aren't made of flesh. ^^;  

[Vena]

hey I posted back to you in the mentor thread heart  

[Viceregal]

I recommend making your images smaller for general posting. Smaller images save bandwidth as well as shorten the loading time for viewers with slow connections. You could always post a smaller image here while also providing a link to the full sized image.

~*~

The best way to approach improvement is exploration. Do it because you want to try new things. Do it because you have more to say about yourself and your integrity as an artist. Allow yourself to feel happy with your art because every finished piece is really an accomplishment.

Training yourself to hate your art will only lead to frustration and frustration often leads to Art Blocks. You really don't want that when you're trying to develop your artistic skill.

~*~

People come in all different shapes and sizes. Not all girls are going to look like the ideal femme. Unless it is your intention to draw idealised female characters (examples: models, Barbie, female super hero) I wouldn't personally worry about changing the way you draw female faces or bodies. That is just my personal opinion though.

Anyway on to the critique!


I would have worked with the table as well but I am absolutely terrible at perspective when it comes to geometric shapes!

Breasts - When an arm is lifted, the breast rises with it just slighty as is demonstrated in my sketch.

Crash Course: Focal Point - The focal point is the spot on your painting you want viewers to look at most, or wherever a person's gaze is brought to most.
I have circled what I have perceived to be the focal point of your composition. All other elements (outlined in red) continuously lead our gaze back to the hot spot. It is a good idea to keep this in mind when putting together a scene.

Gestures and Composition - Body language can play an important role in directing the viewer's eye as well as conveying a mood or expression. I've sketched up 3 different poses for the characters hand, each demonstrating a new compositional posibility.

The first hand has the fingers pointing away from the two characters faces. This could be used to draw the viewer's gaze to a scene off to the left or perhaps something in the backround. The loose grasp of the goblet also suggests a non chalant mood.

The second hand has the fingers pointing back towards the character's faces. This would ultimately help keep the focus on the interaction between the two characters. The delicate grasp on the goblet can also help feminise a character who may seem too masculine.

The third option shows the arm being held close to the body and out of view. This is not as visually appealing as the other two because it creates a big empty space beside the body. This has the unintended effects of making the viewer's eyes explore the empty space instead of returning back to the focal point.

Conclusion - I hope I havn't sounded too pretentious or confusing! Regardless of what anyone says is right or wrong, it is up to you to decide what feels right. Most artists eventually develop their own methods for drawing.

Resources: The Great Big Breast Tutorial, Folded Cloth Stock Images  

[.[ Cheesecube ].]

Oh, wow- thank you!! That was extremely helpfull!! :3 I'll work on the things you noted and check out the tutorials- and also I'll go shrink the image. ^^;

And now I'm off to Vena's thread to see what she'sa helpin' me with. biggrin  

[.[ Cheesecube ].]

Updateddd  

[.[ Cheesecube ].]

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