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Sevendreams

PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 10:48 am
missmagpie
My dance rant:

Dance for me has and always will be the physical representation of music. Without music there can be no dance, and the style of dance is fully dependent on what music is playing. Thus the two are so closely interlinked that I cannot dance to bad music, or if I cannot stand the style of dance.

This can be seen repeatedly throughout dance forms, and the energy evoked in each kind. Ballroom dancing of the Viennese Walzes has an entirely different ambiance to contemporary jazz dance. Salsa is different to tango is different to breakdancing. What connects them all is a common love and respect for the beauty of the music. Each person has their own individual taste in music and therefore are adept at different styles of dance. Yes, even all you shy people out there who say you can't probably can dance. It's just your insecurity that gets in the way.

However, after saying all that there is one style of dance that absolutely disgusts me. Moshing. It's not dance. It's not beautiful. It's not fun. It's pure channelled aggression. Sure that sort of thing has it's place, but not in a night club. A friend of mine likened it to the movie "Fight Club" but with fewer rules. It's like all the kids out there were trying to kill each other. Perhaps it started with the intention of dance (the people who start by jumping up and down in the center, who end up pushing people, who end up pushing back, who end up knocking other people onto the floor who end up hurt. Or sometimes dead.) but there are some people on the sidelines who deliberately push people into the fray for fun. That's not dance. That's bestial aggression in an enclosed environment where people get seriously hurt. Like a pitfight or mob.

I'm a relatively delicate person. If I go near a mosh pit I get hurt. In fact last night in Fibber's I got hit in the face quite hard by careless moshing drunkards. And when they're drunk enough they'll mosh to stuff that I'd like to dance to. So we end up with conflicting interests on the same dance floor; They want to hurt stuff, and I don't want to get hurt. I also want to dance.

This is where partially my disdain for some metal music comes into it. Metal is so uniform and unconducive to delicate dance that mosh was invented. In fact, moshing is pretty much the only way to dance to metal. The music itself is aggressive and fierce, therefore obviously the dancing for it is going to get people hurt. That's pretty much why I don't like most metal. That and I can barely tell the difference between one song and another, they all sound so similar. As far as I can tell they're all about killing themselves, killing their friends or killing their girlfriends. And although there may be a place for that I don't want it on my dance floor.

Thank you. /rant

I am aware there are many metal fans out there and that the aforementioned points are all my opinion. I'd actually be quite interested to hear your thoughts on the matter.


I don't mosh or do straight metal, but I do like punk rock. Specifically, melodic punk, or those variations of punk rock that have flow and rhythm as opposed to mindless growling, screaming and speed strumming; the latter literally makes me sick to my stomach. To name a few I like for the whole melody/lyrics experience: Tsunami Bomb, Skunk Anansie, Anti-Flag and The Vandals. For just the melody, Audiokarate (I really dislike their lyrics at times). For just the lyrics, Less Than Jake. There are a lot more but I really don't want to write a huge list.

For me, the best punk rock I've come across presents melodies to nod my head to and lyics to sing along with that have lessons to learn. Such a wide range of interpretation is given that people can feel free to get psyched, get stupid and get moshing, or just stand at the back of the crowd, show support once in awhile and enjoy the show. I've stayed far away from the pits, and stepped way back when circle pits start pushing through the crowd. Agreed, it is an unbridled release of emotion and anything can happen in there which, I suppose, is probably very freeing in some ways for those that can handle it. Agreed, it does remind me of Fight Club without the rules.

My observations of the pits will never leave me. The animalistic expressions on the faces of participants. The sheer power of unchecked human aggression. The ripples on flesh from impacts and the spraying of sweat and spit on the observers. I believe that there is a limit where you cast off the shackles of rational thought to act purely on animal instinct, and to fully enjoy the mosh, it seems that this limit must be exceeded, to where it does become a high, a trance-like state of raw, chaotic movement, where thought is instant action and there is no concept of consequence. Kinetic intoxication? In that way, I sort of admire moshers, but I would still probably never participate in a mosh pit.  
PostPosted: Sat Jul 22, 2006 3:45 pm
Fiddlers Green

It can be as simple as a single tone from a tuning fork (Note E) struck at the mid point of the Northerly, by a copper rod or a reproduction of the alarm sounded in Krakow (1241), complete with sudden drop (historically, the trumpeter was slain by a Tartar arrow).

You know they still play that same, altered trumpet piece on the hour to the four directions from the trumpter's tower in Krakow. Except that now it's a recording...

Quote:
It can also be as complicated as a specifically composed musical piece designed to incorporate Harmonics, imagery, and symbolic instrument resonance to aid in the desired affect.
*curiousity rising* Without asking too many questions (ie tell me when to shut up), what sort of harmonics, imagery and instruments would you use for an effect? Do you have all sorts of precise specifics on what sort of harmonies and instruments are used? Are there precise methods to the composition? Would you like to share examples or would that be asking too much? And tell me when to stop because I get a little overexcited when it comes to music sometimes... sweatdrop

Quote:
But, as most of my associates are tone deaf, we don't use it as much as I would like.
confused
But you have a lovely singing voice! It would be a shame not to use it! surprised  

Pelta


Fiddlers Green

PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 3:45 am
missmagpie
You know they still play that same, altered trumpet piece on the hour to the four directions from the trumpter's tower in Krakow. Except that now it's a recording...

It's a recording now?
How sad.


Quote:
*curiousity rising* Without asking too many questions (ie tell me when to shut up), what sort of harmonics, imagery and instruments would you use for an effect? Do you have all sorts of precise specifics on what sort of harmonies and instruments are used? Are there precise methods to the composition? Would you like to share examples or would that be asking too much? And tell me when to stop because I get a little overexcited when it comes to music sometimes... sweatdrop

Well, just as we ascribe diagrams to aspects of existance, a part of the diagram is sonic in nature, Sound exists at frequencies and in patterns... these specifics are just as useful to my practices as propper physical materials and less harmonic vocal intonations.
Also, and especially when dealing with foreign intellegences, knowing their particular tastes, or setting a conditional triggered by a specific piece of music can be usefull. Now, as with any other formulae we use, very few generalities can be made, each formula, and all of it's components are specifically chosen (if not fashioned) for the specific task at hand.
As far as specific instruments... it is our experience that a note produced on a wind instrument is not, exactly, interchangeable with say, oh, a stringed instrument....
Ultimately, it involves alot of tedious gazing at Sheet Music, Decibil sheets, patterns left from recordingthe sound in varying media, and plenty of trial and error in controled environments.
But the end result, will, hopefully create melodies which can accomplish with a deliberate harmonic intonation, what may otherwise require a less plesant form of execution.
The precision required in musical performance, the exact memorization and reproduction, and the idea of compelling effect thru and indirect medium, thru applied rules of melody and something as patterned as harmonics truely (if you'll forgive the pun) strikes a cord with my society.

Quote:
But you have a lovely singing voice! It would be a shame not to use it! surprised

xd
Nonsense...
And besides, a choir with only one mediocre voice, and many disonant ones will cause only disaster. sweatdrop  
PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 10:23 am


So my music history lecturer took us to the college chapel today for our class on 17th Century sacred music. He then proceeded to personally play for us all of the examples for the class on the church organ. Did I mention he's one of the best organists in Dublin? It was so cool. whee

It also got me thinking. How wonderful it must be to have that kind of music as a normal part of your weekly worship! The closest I have to anything like that are the wordless songs I sing to my Deity, and that's nothing like a full Bach chorale. That's one thing a lot of pagan paths are really missing out on. We have no J. S. Bach. To my knowledge there are very few pagan chorales or devotional songs. Why? Why should so many pagans be lacking in one of the most soulful ways of worship?

Ok we also don't have several thousand years of patronage of the arts, or the money to do so, or any of those factors that actually led to the mass composition of incredible sacred music, but that's beside the point.

The point of this current rant is that WE NEED MORE MUSIC!  

Pelta


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 1:49 pm
missmagpie
The point of this current rant is that WE NEED MORE MUSIC!

I'm working on my "become a billionaire" plan. It's right up there with my "get a new job" plan  
PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:18 pm
missmagpie
The point of this current rant is that WE NEED MORE MUSIC!

Every fugue is an ode to Ginungigap; they just didn't know it. ninja  

Deoridhe
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TheDisreputableDog

PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:20 pm
missmagpie
Oh whatever, this was a cool topic and you know it. wink

missmagpie
The point of this current rant is that WE NEED MORE MUSIC!
Very true. I've sung both Mozart's and Duruflé's Requiem with chorus in high school, and they were incredible experiences. heart

But how much more incredible it must be for someone to whom the actual message is relevant. Therefore, we need amazing choral music that is relevant. smile  
PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 1:54 am
reagun ban
missmagpie
The point of this current rant is that WE NEED MORE MUSIC!

I'm working on my "become a billionaire" plan. It's right up there with my "get a new job" plan
Fine. You become a billionaire and then commission me to write sacred pagan music. That way we all win! biggrin Also on first typing I wrote "That way we all wing."
Deo: How so? How is fugue related to Ginungigap?

TheDisreputableDog
missmagpie


Oh whatever, this was a cool topic and you know it. wink
Aw you're making me blush! redface

Quote:
But how much more incredible it must be for someone to whom the actual message is relevant. Therefore, we need amazing choral music that is relevant. smile
Unfortunately the problem with that is actually finding the chorus. Church music works well because the entire congregation sings the cantatas. Even if they're really hard, there is the religious base to have a whole choir for a mass. Mind you, in some of the earlier sacred music they might have also sung one to a part.

So the problem in a way is almost just manpower. Bach had whole churches full of people at his disposal. We do not. They also have a unified set of beliefs. We definately do not. So I could write an Asatru chorale or something, just to find that there's only five Asatru in the world who follow those exact precepts, and only three of them can sing. And one has a sore throat.

So in a way chorales are out. However, two person duets and solo songs seem to have some possibility. Even some faith-oriented instrumental music might be nice. I may be able to work on some of these over the next while. It's just a matter of getting my scanner to work again.

Oh, and there's always the possibility of changing the words to existing chorales. However, that may be disrespectful, especially in Bach, who put so many religious references directly into his music.  

Pelta


TheDisreputableDog

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 2:30 am
missmagpie
Oh, and there's always the possibility of changing the words to existing chorales. However, that may be disrespectful, especially in Bach, who put so many religious references directly into his music.
How so?  
PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 3:51 am
TheDisreputableDog
missmagpie
Oh, and there's always the possibility of changing the words to existing chorales. However, that may be disrespectful, especially in Bach, who put so many religious references directly into his music.
How so?
Well for example in the chorale we listened to yesterday, "Dies sind die Heilige Zehn Gebot," (these are the holy ten commandments) he puts in references to the ten commandments in the very first bar. It begins with five Gs in the melody. The melody is played in canon with itself, so it begins with ten Gs representing the ten commandments. Bach was full of this sort of stuff. The same piece also includes a walking bass, possibly alluding to walking in the light of the Lord, which is what following the ten commandments is all about.

This is partially what makes his music so wonderfully fascinating. Not only is it some of the best music ever written, it was written entirely out of glory and worship. That's possibly why it is some of the best music ever written. There's something to be said for divine inspiration...  

Pelta


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:24 am
missmagpie
Deo: How so? How is fugue related to Ginungigap?

Fugues are aural fractals. I'm firmly of the opinion that Ginungigap is made up of equal parts fractals and chaos. Therefore, bad grunge metal and fugues are both Odes to Ginungigap. whee  
PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 7:56 am
missmagpie
Well for example in the chorale we listened to yesterday, "Dies sind die Heilige Zehn Gebot," (these are the holy ten commandments) he puts in references to the ten commandments in the very first bar. It begins with five Gs in the melody. The melody is played in canon with itself, so it begins with ten Gs representing the ten commandments. Bach was full of this sort of stuff. The same piece also includes a walking bass, possibly alluding to walking in the light of the Lord, which is what following the ten commandments is all about.

This is partially what makes his music so wonderfully fascinating. Not only is it some of the best music ever written, it was written entirely out of glory and worship. That's possibly why it is some of the best music ever written. There's something to be said for divine inspiration...
That's so cool. surprised I never knew that.  

TheDisreputableDog


Pelta

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 8:15 am
Deoridhe
missmagpie
Deo: How so? How is fugue related to Ginungigap?

Fugues are aural fractals. I'm firmly of the opinion that Ginungigap is made up of equal parts fractals and chaos. Therefore, bad grunge metal and fugues are both Odes to Ginungigap. whee
Teehee. Cool. In the fugue version that Bach did of the earlier chorale I was talking about the theme has (you guessed it) ten entries. Ten at once! Mighty cool. I'm considering writing something paltry along those lines. I aint no Johann S. Bach but I could give it a go. If only my scanner wasn't fried... stare

I'm also curious if anyone's a decent lyricist. I may be an English student but I'm rather crap when it comes to writing decent lyrics. If anyone has some they'd like to put up I may be able to set them to music. Nothing huge now... I'm thinking around 14 syllables to start. And no promises either. I've got a lot of work and a dodgy scanner...  
PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 8:39 am
missmagpie
I'm also curious if anyone's a decent lyricist. I may be an English student but I'm rather crap when it comes to writing decent lyrics. If anyone has some they'd like to put up I may be able to set them to music. Nothing huge now... I'm thinking around 14 syllables to start. And no promises either. I've got a lot of work and a dodgy scanner...

I fancy myself a poet. Give me a theme and a rhythm scheme and I'll see what I can do. There's a bit of my poetry in my Pathways thread and more in my creative worlks lj, Usuyami, if you want a feel for the quality I produce.  

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Kal Eldritch

PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 11:06 pm
missmagpie
I'm also curious if anyone's a decent lyricist. I may be an English student but I'm rather crap when it comes to writing decent lyrics. If anyone has some they'd like to put up I may be able to set them to music. Nothing huge now... I'm thinking around 14 syllables to start. And no promises either. I've got a lot of work and a dodgy scanner...
I'm an okay poet when the notion to write it comes to me. I don't really have any of my past works that you could reference (they're very...personal), but I suppose I could write me some of that fancy poetry stuff so you could see what my work is like.  
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