Tarot?

[Bastemhet]

TeaDidikai

Sophist

What's your method of making an oracle deck?

I'm drawing on key cultural themes and personal experiences and contextualizing them within the folklore I grew up with.

For example, there's a story about a fearsome creature that was tricked into thinking a man was stronger than him. There is a picture of the beginning of the story and in a reading it will translate as "Beware of self delusion. When weak, feign strength, when strong, feign weakness" and other similar themes that are present in the story that will be brought to prominence within the reading depending on the situation the reading is questioning and what other cards (and hence, themes and meanings) are on the table.

Thanks for this. Now that I think of it, the symbolism in Ancient Egypt has huge potential for an oracle deck. I would like to create something like this; maybe it will be a pet project when I can devote more time to it. If you have any suggestions about cataloging meanings within specific contexts, or other things you might share, I would appreciate it.  

[Nines19]

TeaDidikai

Nines19

Shall we discuss interpretations of this idea? ninja

Fire away.

Well, if we apply that concept to other things, it doesn't work out so neatly. Books are just lots of pieces of paper with ink on them, but they can tell us many things - from our favorite story to the history of a nation.

The conclusion - "They don't tell anyone anything" - may or may not be true, but it doesn't necessarily follow from the premise ("Their pieces of paper with ink on them." ).

We might also define "tell," "anyone," and "anything," as a means of determining whether the conclusion is true or not. If you're going by a literal verbal definition of the word "tell," then they certainly don't tell people things, but that's a little disingenuous, IMO - it can be argued that most people probably wouldn't assume that cards do literally speak.  

[rmcdra]

Nines19

TeaDidikai

Nines19

Shall we discuss interpretations of this idea? ninja

Fire away.

Well, if we apply that concept to other things, it doesn't work out so neatly. Books are just lots of pieces of paper with ink on them, but they can tell us many things - from our favorite story to the history of a nation.

The conclusion - "They don't tell anyone anything" - may or may not be true, but it doesn't necessarily follow from the premise ("Their pieces of paper with ink on them." ).

We might also define "tell," "anyone," and "anything," as a means of determining whether the conclusion is true or not. If you're going by a literal verbal definition of the word "tell," then they certainly don't tell people things, but that's a little disingenuous, IMO - it can be argued that most people probably wouldn't assume that cards do literally speak.

But it is not the words that are actually telling us stuff in books. It is the way that we understand the words, how we understand the language that it was written in, how we understand the author, how we understand the history in which the book was written, our psychological state, our intellectual capacity, etc... It is all these factors that influence whether a book is just pieces of paper with ink or something more.

Example: Bible is pieces of paper with ink. I see it as a beautiful book with lots of information that can help my spiritual development that I'm still trying to fully grasp. Someone else though might see a horrible book promoting bigotry, misogyny, and the stunting of one's intellectual development. Another might see lots of quick rolling paper xd .

If the bible actually told something then we would all get the same message, so my conclusion is that it is ourselves that is deriving a meaning from the interpretation of the symbols shown. A book is kinda bad example because a book often uses standardized symbols that most are familiar with.

In the case of tarot, there are often non-standardized symbols used that may be unique to the artist, the community the artist is a part of, or the time period of the artist that carry a meaning to the artist, all of which we as a diviner, may or may not be aware of. This is how I would understand that the best tarot or oracle decks are one's that are made by the diviner.  

[TeaDidikai]

Sophist

If you have any suggestions about cataloging meanings within specific contexts, or other things you might share, I would appreciate it.

Start at the beginning. And when you get to the end, stop.  

[TeaDidikai]

Nines19

Well, if we apply that concept to other things, it doesn't work out so neatly. Books are just lots of pieces of paper with ink on them, but they can tell us many things - from our favorite story to the history of a nation.

The books do no such thing. wink

The reader tells themselves that much by interpreting what is in front of them. In the case of the books- letters.

I'll use Red as an example. In a post where I responded to Red's false claims about the Wica, I addressed what Wica is, and from that she told herself I was 1) A member of the Cult 2) Obsessed with sex 3) A slut and 4) Had desires to not be seen as such.

Clearly, since I didn't provide misinformation, and yet, her conclusions are everything but fact- this information came not from her computer, not from me, not from objective reality, but from herself.

Quote:

We might also define "tell," "anyone," and "anything," as a means of determining whether the conclusion is true or not. If you're going by a literal verbal definition of the word "tell," then they certainly don't tell people things, but that's a little disingenuous, IMO - it can be argued that most people probably wouldn't assume that cards do literally speak.

One man's disingenuousness is another man's wit.  

[redtearsblackwings]

Can someone tell me, does Tarot or Orical give you a deeper understanding of the reading?
PS can I get an answer from someoen who believes that Tarot/Orical will tell you something.  

[Collowrath]

redtearsblackwings

Can someone tell me, does Tarot or Orical give you a deeper understanding of the reading?

It's already been explained to you: Tarot is a specific kind of cards; anything else that has a similar purpose but different design and suits, etc, are oracle cards.

Neither of them tell you more or less than the other. Whether or not you have a "deeper understanding" of any reading, tarot or not, is up to how good you are.  

[TeaDidikai]

redtearsblackwings

Can someone tell me, does Tarot or Orical give you a deeper understanding of the reading?

Depends. Do you want them to lie to you?

Quote:

PS can I get an answer from someoen who believes that Tarot/Orical will tell you something.

Why cherry pick your answers? Why not examine what is being discussed and actually respond to the information being presented rather than being selective and trying to find information which may well be wrong, just so it can further perpetuate any bad information you've already decided you liked?  

[redtearsblackwings]

Collowrath

redtearsblackwings

Can someone tell me, does Tarot or Orical give you a deeper understanding of the reading?

It's already been explained to you: Tarot is a specific kind of cards; anything else that has a similar purpose but different design and suits, etc, are oracle cards.

Neither of them tell you more or less than the other. Whether or not you have a "deeper understanding" of any reading, tarot or not, is up to how good you are.

No what was explaned was the differance.
But you have explained that the reading is the same, thank you.  

[redtearsblackwings]

Quote:

PS can I get an answer from someoen who believes that Tarot/Orical will tell you something. Why cherry pick your answers? Why not examine what is being discussed and actually respond to the information being presented rather than being selective and trying to find information which may well be wrong, just so it can further perpetuate any bad information you've already decided you liked?

Well I just thought it sounded nicer then saying that I dont like the way you answer my questions so I don't want you answering this one.  

[Ultramarine Violet]

Collowrath

redtearsblackwings

Can someone tell me, does Tarot or Orical give you a deeper understanding of the reading?

It's already been explained to you: Tarot is a specific kind of cards; anything else that has a similar purpose but different design and suits, etc, are oracle cards.

Neither of them tell you more or less than the other. Whether or not you have a "deeper understanding" of any reading, tarot or not, is up to how good you are.

Collowrath: It might be fair to note that a deeper understanding of card readings, whether Tarot or Oracle, can also be attained/enriched by study. In terms of Tarot, I find correspondences to be a useful place to start - z.B. looking up herbal correspondences to the Major Arcana and relating the herbal energies/uses to the card can enhance what one's already learned from study exclusively within data and definitions provided from a solely Tarot-based perspective.

Interrelating the data from seemingly opposed (or at least vastly different) Major Arcana, and comparing herbal, planetary, elemental, and numerological correspondences thereof, could be an interesting thought excercise, now it occurs to me. heart

As for the original topic - I was actually given a rather interesting (though somewhat biased) oracle deck called "Healing with the Faeries". I haven't gotten much good out of it, except for pretty generic good advice - use positive affirmation to change your behavior for the wiser, cleaner, and healthier. But it's very possible that I'm being inhibited by the fact that I'm somewhat suspicious of any object or set of beliefs that portray faeries in only a positive light. From what I understand, aren't they cast as something of troublemakers, in common folklore? Or did that just rise as a rather confused provincial attitude with the spread of Christianity?  

[redtearsblackwings]

Ultramarine Violet

Collowrath

redtearsblackwings

Can someone tell me, does Tarot or Orical give you a deeper understanding of the reading?

It's already been explained to you: Tarot is a specific kind of cards; anything else that has a similar purpose but different design and suits, etc, are oracle cards.

Neither of them tell you more or less than the other. Whether or not you have a "deeper understanding" of any reading, tarot or not, is up to how good you are.

Collowrath: It might be fair to note that a deeper understanding of card readings, whether Tarot or Oracle, can also be attained/enriched by study. In terms of Tarot, I find correspondences to be a useful place to start - z.B. looking up herbal correspondences to the Major Arcana and relating the herbal energies/uses to the card can enhance what one's already learned from study exclusively within data and definitions provided from a solely Tarot-based perspective.

Interrelating the data from seemingly opposed (or at least vastly different) Major Arcana, and comparing herbal, planetary, elemental, and numerological correspondences thereof, could be an interesting thought excercise, now it occurs to me. heart

As for the original topic - I was actually given a rather interesting (though somewhat biased) oracle deck called "Healing with the Faeries". I haven't gotten much good out of it, except for pretty generic good advice - use positive affirmation to change your behavior for the wiser, cleaner, and healthier. But it's very possible that I'm being inhibited by the fact that I'm somewhat suspicious of any object or set of beliefs that portray faeries in only a positive light. From what I understand, aren't they cast as something of troublemakers, in common folklore? Or did that just rise as a rather confused provincial attitude with the spread of Christianity?

Thank you, even though I know this wasn't directed at me it's cleared alot up for me.  

[Ultramarine Violet]

redtearsblackwings

Ultramarine Violet

Collowrath

redtearsblackwings

Can someone tell me, does Tarot or Orical give you a deeper understanding of the reading?

It's already been explained to you: Tarot is a specific kind of cards; anything else that has a similar purpose but different design and suits, etc, are oracle cards.

Neither of them tell you more or less than the other. Whether or not you have a "deeper understanding" of any reading, tarot or not, is up to how good you are.

Collowrath: It might be fair to note that a deeper understanding of card readings, whether Tarot or Oracle, can also be attained/enriched by study. In terms of Tarot, I find correspondences to be a useful place to start - z.B. looking up herbal correspondences to the Major Arcana and relating the herbal energies/uses to the card can enhance what one's already learned from study exclusively within data and definitions provided from a solely Tarot-based perspective.

Interrelating the data from seemingly opposed (or at least vastly different) Major Arcana, and comparing herbal, planetary, elemental, and numerological correspondences thereof, could be an interesting thought excercise, now it occurs to me. heart

As for the original topic - I was actually given a rather interesting (though somewhat biased) oracle deck called "Healing with the Faeries". I haven't gotten much good out of it, except for pretty generic good advice - use positive affirmation to change your behavior for the wiser, cleaner, and healthier. But it's very possible that I'm being inhibited by the fact that I'm somewhat suspicious of any object or set of beliefs that portray faeries in only a positive light. From what I understand, aren't they cast as something of troublemakers, in common folklore? Or did that just rise as a rather confused provincial attitude with the spread of Christianity?

Thank you, even though I know this wasn't directed at me it's cleared alot up for me.

Er, glad I could help. Please be aware, though, that what I've said is a very limited means, and not to be mistaken for an end. Knowing something will work or help is different from initiating it, and the learning process is ongoing - I'm finding that out to my increasing exhaustion. sweatdrop The more you know, the more you know that you don't know. Or, if you prefer, "The greater the island of knowledge, the wider the shore of mystery."  

[Nines19]

TeaDidikai

Nines19

Well, if we apply that concept to other things, it doesn't work out so neatly. Books are just lots of pieces of paper with ink on them, but they can tell us many things - from our favorite story to the history of a nation.

The books do no such thing. wink

The reader tells themselves that much by interpreting what is in front of them. In the case of the books- letters.

I'll use Red as an example. In a post where I responded to Red's false claims about the Wica, I addressed what Wica is, and from that she told herself I was 1) A member of the Cult 2) Obsessed with sex 3) A slut and 4) Had desires to not be seen as such.

Clearly, since I didn't provide misinformation, and yet, her conclusions are everything but fact- this information came not from her computer, not from me, not from objective reality, but from herself.

So what you (and rmcdra?) are saying is that the cards don't tell, but provide a basis for what the reader can interpret from them?  

[Collowrath]

Ultramarine Violet

"The greater the island of knowledge, the wider the shore of mystery."

Uproot your questions from their ground and the dangling roots will be seen. More questions! - Mentat Zensufi, Chapterhouse: Dune.

I agree with your previous post, deeper study into all the associations of the cards can lend greater perspective. Perspective is good!