Creationism vs. Darwinism

[Tirissana]

The Amazing Ryuu

zz1000zz

Science expects there will always be more things to study. Given the size and complexity of this universe, nobody should seriously expect humans to ever understand all the physical processes of it. And yes, there are some crazy things at the sub-atomic level. Why shouldn't there be? Why would anyone expect the universe to work only in ways that are easily translatable into current human understanding?

That's the reason I love physics. I love seeing them have all these rules and regulations about how the world works and then have to pull their hair out once they get smaller than an atom. Of course, I feel bad for Steven Hawking and his friends, trying to make that universal theory. I don't think that goal is EVER going to be accomplished.

Actually CERN is working on completing the theory. :3  

[The Amazing Ryuu]

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

Actually CERN is working on completing the theory. :3

I know. I feel bad for them. It's been the better part of 20 years and the more they find, they more frustrated they are.  

[Tirissana]

The Amazing Ryuu

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

Actually CERN is working on completing the theory. :3

I know. I feel bad for them. It's been the better part of 20 years and the more they find, they more frustrated they are.

No actually they won't be frustrated. It would better explain how the universe is explained. I believe in the bible it says "God said let there be light and there was light" If anything that "description" if you could call that a description is more frustrating. It doesn't explain anything besides God did it. How did he do it? How did it happen? The answer because it's God, and that's what God does, or God is great, or any other lazy haphazard reason someone can give about God creating the universe is not satisfactory. It doesn't answer the question. At least science provides the how questions. :3 And what my friend is sad is that so many people can't answer that magical question. How? biggrin  

[The Amazing Ryuu]

That's what I was trying to say. You just said it way better. lol  

[Tirissana]

The Amazing Ryuu

That's what I was trying to say. You just said it way better. lol

o.o how. And I meant to say Science answers the how questions. xD  

[Fushigi na Butterfly]

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

The Amazing Ryuu

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

Actually CERN is working on completing the theory. :3

I know. I feel bad for them. It's been the better part of 20 years and the more they find, they more frustrated they are.

No actually they won't be frustrated. It would better explain how the universe is explained. I believe in the bible it says "God said let there be light and there was light" If anything that "description" if you could call that a description is more frustrating. It doesn't explain anything besides God did it. How did he do it? How did it happen? The answer because it's God, and that's what God does, or God is great, or any other lazy haphazard reason someone can give about God creating the universe is not satisfactory. It doesn't answer the question. At least science provides the how questions. :3 And what my friend is sad is that so many people can't answer that magical question. How? biggrin

There are parts of science that do the exact same thing- the "why/how?" question with the answer of "well, that's just what it does." Why do chemicals react the way they do? What is it about the elements in their compounds that causes them to react? Well, why do they react that way and not another way? Alot of the time, the answer you get is "that's what it does." The answer is no more or less "lazy" or "haphazard" than "because God is God."  

[Tirissana]

Fushigi na Butterfly

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

The Amazing Ryuu

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

Actually CERN is working on completing the theory. :3

I know. I feel bad for them. It's been the better part of 20 years and the more they find, they more frustrated they are.

No actually they won't be frustrated. It would better explain how the universe is explained. I believe in the bible it says "God said let there be light and there was light" If anything that "description" if you could call that a description is more frustrating. It doesn't explain anything besides God did it. How did he do it? How did it happen? The answer because it's God, and that's what God does, or God is great, or any other lazy haphazard reason someone can give about God creating the universe is not satisfactory. It doesn't answer the question. At least science provides the how questions. :3 And what my friend is sad is that so many people can't answer that magical question. How? biggrin

There are parts of science that do the exact same thing- the "why/how?" question with the answer of "well, that's just what it does." Why do chemicals react the way they do? What is it about the elements in their compounds that causes them to react? Well, why do they react that way and not another way? Alot of the time, the answer you get is "that's what it does." The answer is no more or less "lazy" or "haphazard" than "because God is God."

Actually concerning chemicals, the answer to the question isn't that's what it does. It's more of "every action has a reaction. If you add chemical x to chemical y then you'll get chemical z or a massive explosion." Course I never took a class in chemistry just introduction to physics and chemistry. But that is basic science.

It's cause and effect really. :3  

[Fushigi na Butterfly]

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

Fushigi na Butterfly

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

The Amazing Ryuu

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

Actually CERN is working on completing the theory. :3

I know. I feel bad for them. It's been the better part of 20 years and the more they find, they more frustrated they are.

No actually they won't be frustrated. It would better explain how the universe is explained. I believe in the bible it says "God said let there be light and there was light" If anything that "description" if you could call that a description is more frustrating. It doesn't explain anything besides God did it. How did he do it? How did it happen? The answer because it's God, and that's what God does, or God is great, or any other lazy haphazard reason someone can give about God creating the universe is not satisfactory. It doesn't answer the question. At least science provides the how questions. :3 And what my friend is sad is that so many people can't answer that magical question. How? biggrin

There are parts of science that do the exact same thing- the "why/how?" question with the answer of "well, that's just what it does." Why do chemicals react the way they do? What is it about the elements in their compounds that causes them to react? Well, why do they react that way and not another way? Alot of the time, the answer you get is "that's what it does." The answer is no more or less "lazy" or "haphazard" than "because God is God."

Actually concerning chemicals, the answer to the question isn't that's what it does. It's more of "every action has a reaction. If you add chemical x to chemical y then you'll get chemical z or a massive explosion." Course I never took a class in chemistry just introduction to physics and chemistry. But that is basic science.

It's cause and effect really. :3

Right, but my point is that, going with the metaphor, God would be the cause. It's just the natural course of things.  

[Priestley]

The Amazing Ryuu

I first learned in my freshman biology class that how scientists think the earth was created and the order in which life appeared heavily correlates to Genesis. This is a link that writes it out quite nicely. I was hoping for a chart, but it seems I'm either typing in the wrong keywords or nobody's sat down and done it yet.

Also... since I think the current discussion was on the literal six-day theory... wasn't the sun and moon not made until the third or fourth day? So, it could NOT have been a literal 24-hour day that was mentioned in the Bible.

When this was written, a day was sunup to sunset, and night was sunset to sunup. If you experienced a length of time, completely undeterminable, that was light, and then an equally undeterminable length of dark, wouldn't you call that a whole day? So it was dark for an undertermined length of time before the light and dark got seperated... night into day. Then after another undetermined length of time, the dark and light got set into their appropriate rotations. Day into night. Two days. However long that might have actually have been.

I want to be pernickety.

In the context of the Old Testament, a day was a cycle combining first night (period before sunrise) and then day (period before sunset), not day-then-night. Also, 'day' is clearly different from 'a day'.

Also, there is clear distinction between the light that God spoke into being and the two lights marking day and night (the sun and the moon with stars).

I think the issue is mainly the duration of 'a day' as it is used in Genesis.  

[The Amazing Ryuu]

Priestley

I want to be pernickety.

You're turning into zz is what you're doing. xp Don't nitpick at me. It was really early and you all understood exactly what I was saying. smile  

[zz1000zz]

The Amazing Ryuu

Priestley

I want to be pernickety.

You're turning into zz is what you're doing. xp Don't nitpick at me. It was really early and you all understood exactly what I was saying. smile

I am not sure how to feel about this. I guess I am having a good influence?  

[The Amazing Ryuu]

zz1000zz

I am not sure how to feel about this. I guess I am having a good influence?

You're very thorough when it comes to discussion. xd  

[zz1000zz]

The Amazing Ryuu

zz1000zz

I am not sure how to feel about this. I guess I am having a good influence?

You're very thorough when it comes to discussion. xd

Hey, everyone being more like me sounds like a good thing. That way I can mock everyone for being posers, perpetually chasing after their better.

It seems nice to have a single, catch-all insult to use for anyone.  

[Priestley]

zz1000zz

The Amazing Ryuu

zz1000zz

I am not sure how to feel about this. I guess I am having a good influence?

You're very thorough when it comes to discussion. xd

Hey, everyone being more like me sounds like a good thing. That way I can mock everyone for being posers, perpetually chasing after their better.

It seems nice to have a single, catch-all insult to use for anyone.

We're all drawn to what we find attractive. In that respect, you are the same. We simply admire you for your never-ending quest for perfection. It encourages us to reach beyond our means. smile

Back to the topic, I view the story of creation as a means for the layman to understand the beginnings of himself and the vastly expansive universe in which he lives. Scientists have a different, more precise perspective on the origins of the universe and have a different language to describe it, that's all.  

[Aachren]

Fushigi na Butterfly

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

Fushigi na Butterfly

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

The Amazing Ryuu

-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden

Actually CERN is working on completing the theory. :3

I know. I feel bad for them. It's been the better part of 20 years and the more they find, they more frustrated they are.

No actually they won't be frustrated. It would better explain how the universe is explained. I believe in the bible it says "God said let there be light and there was light" If anything that "description" if you could call that a description is more frustrating. It doesn't explain anything besides God did it. How did he do it? How did it happen? The answer because it's God, and that's what God does, or God is great, or any other lazy haphazard reason someone can give about God creating the universe is not satisfactory. It doesn't answer the question. At least science provides the how questions. :3 And what my friend is sad is that so many people can't answer that magical question. How? biggrin

There are parts of science that do the exact same thing- the "why/how?" question with the answer of "well, that's just what it does." Why do chemicals react the way they do? What is it about the elements in their compounds that causes them to react? Well, why do they react that way and not another way? Alot of the time, the answer you get is "that's what it does." The answer is no more or less "lazy" or "haphazard" than "because God is God."

Actually concerning chemicals, the answer to the question isn't that's what it does. It's more of "every action has a reaction. If you add chemical x to chemical y then you'll get chemical z or a massive explosion." Course I never took a class in chemistry just introduction to physics and chemistry. But that is basic science.

It's cause and effect really. :3

Right, but my point is that, going with the metaphor, God would be the cause. It's just the natural course of things.

Eh, as a chemist, I'd have to say that its a little more complicated than all that...that and we use a lot of not-real structures to define what is happening and why at the molecular level.

Anyway, back to the subject at hand.
You know we have no chemical mechanism for the creation of life.
Now, I'm not saying that you can prove scientifically that life arose as the Genesis story states because you can't. We can't repeat that experiment. But I'm not thinking that you can prove that we came up from primordial soup either.
Somehow, I think this is an advantage.

Oh, someone really needs to define 'evolution' for the purposes of this thread.
I suggest the terms 'macro-evolution' and 'micro-evolution.'
Despite the fact that someone will jump down my throat for 'drawing the line in the sand.'