Animist?

[TeaDidikai]

bondage bunnie

I do not think that everything has self aware spirit or a soul.

Why?

Quote:

Seems a little too far fetched even for religion.

What makes other's traditions too far fetched given their nature as non-falsifiable ideologies?  

[Fiddlers Green]

For those that religiously identify as animists...

When an alloy is created... for example, when Copper and Arsenic are combined to form bronze, what happens to the spriits of the individual ingots of Copper and Arsenic? Are they spliced, or do they die and become something new?  

[TeaDidikai]

Fiddlers Green

For those that religiously identify as animists...

When an alloy is created... for example, when Copper and Arsenic are combined to form bronze, what happens to the spriits of the individual ingots of Copper and Arsenic? Are they spliced, or do they die and become something new?

My personal understanding is that it things are constantly in a state of flux, between being "awake" and "asleep".

When it came to the alloy, it would depend on which materials were awake before and after the process.  

[Koravin]

I think all spirits are the same. Spirits inhabit many things, and the spirit of say a human and a tuna are basically the same. I think spirits can inhabit inanimate objects, but are not as bound to say a rock as they would be to an organism.  

[Fiddlers Green]

Koravin

I think all spirits are the same. Spirits inhabit many things, and the spirit of say a human and a tuna are basically the same. I think spirits can inhabit inanimate objects, but are not as bound to say a rock as they would be to an organism.

What happens to the spirit of the cow when it is eaten?
Is it subsumed within the spirit of the creature that consumes it?  

[Labores Luna]

I consider myself to be an animist because I see everything as being part of one spirit, as we are all different parts and manifestations of that one spirit. I see this spirit as being conscious, and so everything within it is conscious on some level or another, but the consciousness of a human, a tree, and a cloud are all very different. I don't regard myself as following any doctrine that makes me feel this way, although my other spiritual and religious beliefs have influences. It mainly derives personal experience though.

What is the relationship between humanity and other spirits in the general cosmology? How about specific relationships?
I think that it depends on the human and other spirit. I personally feel that we used to be very consciously aware to the spirits around us, those of plants, animals, and other beings, but when it comes to people in the modern world we are generally more consciously disconnected than before. Even though we, as humans, may not acknowledge them as much or in the same way, I still think that we influence each other and are forever woven together. Any specific relationship is up to the human and the other being.

What about relationships between yourself and spirits recently introduced to you?

That depends what spirit that you're talking about. My cat, the acacia tree that I talk to on my way to work, or the sun? Howabout the big rock in the corner of my yard? They're all different relationships.  

[TeaDidikai]

Fiddlers Green

What happens to the spirit of the cow when it is eaten?

In the school of thought I subscribe to the being that was "cow" is no more- the spirit goes elsewhere. The being that is "this part of muscle" stays until it is no longer such either.  

[CuAnnan]

Fiddlers Green

For those that religiously identify as animists...

When an alloy is created... for example, when Copper and Arsenic are combined to form bronze, what happens to the spriits of the individual ingots of Copper and Arsenic? Are they spliced, or do they die and become something new?

Depends entirely.
I love metalurgy because of how well it gels with my world view. Egoethnocentrig I know, but I'm both egocentric and ethnicentric.

Sometimes the metal spirits cannot coexist and you get crap end results (insoluble alloys)
Sometimes spirit A will eat spirit B absorbing some of its properties (soluble alloys)
Sometimes spirit A and spirit B will live together (semisoluble alloys).

In the case of the first, there are (what were originally {in Gaelic society} rituals but have since become) techniques for alloying insoluble alloys but I don't remember them offhand. I'd have to dig up my Leaving Cert books and they're all in storage in Donegal somewhere.

In the case of the second two, it all depends on the quantities involved. I can't remember if Bronze is a soluble or semisoluble alloy. My dad, the metalsmith, thinks it's semisoluble. I'm inclined to agree with him, but those are just two educated guesses.

Clearly, the examples I've given are incredibly simplified. There are soluble and semisoluble alloys wherein the spirits and metals do not consume each other, but live in a sort of stable equilibrium (as opposed to unstable equilibria which are a result of bad smelting).

This is only considering what happens in nature.

Alloying is an old tradition. There are rituals to it, even now, though they have been mechanised. The additions of impurities to change the quality of the metal produced add several layers of complexity. Down to the order and means by which they are added.

Then you have tempering to factor into the equation.

Beyond this, we're venturing into information that is protected by Oaths, though not Oathbound. I am not willing to discuss it in such an open forum, but we have Skype material. wink  

[Fiddlers Green]

TeaDidikai

In the school of thought I subscribe to the being that was "cow" is no more- the spirit goes elsewhere. The being that is "this part of muscle" stays until it is no longer such either.

Elsewhere to where?  

[Koravin]

Fiddlers Green

Koravin

I think all spirits are the same. Spirits inhabit many things, and the spirit of say a human and a tuna are basically the same. I think spirits can inhabit inanimate objects, but are not as bound to say a rock as they would be to an organism.

What happens to the spirit of the cow when it is eaten?
Is it subsumed within the spirit of the creature that consumes it?

I don't think so. I think the spirit detaches itself from the body after death.  

[Koravin]

Fiddlers Green

TeaDidikai

In the school of thought I subscribe to the being that was "cow" is no more- the spirit goes elsewhere. The being that is "this part of muscle" stays until it is no longer such either.

Elsewhere to where?

I think spirits spend some time disembodied before bonding to another organism.  

[Fiddlers Green]

Koravin

I think spirits spend some time disembodied before bonding to another organism.

Think you that such an unattached spirit might be coerced into something?
If so, would it affect that object it entered in any appreciable way?

Also, to clarify on the spirit detaching after death...
What of things that are not viewed as alive anyway, such as a river, or an iron ingot... would those have no spirit to begin with?  

[CuAnnan]

Fiddlers Green

Think you that such an unattached spirit might be coerced into something?

If this is an open question, then absolutely.
There are ways of asking, ways of strongly suggesting, ways of threatening and ways of forcing.
I, personally, find the second two distasteful. They are dissonant.
Spirit binding, with consent, is something that I have some experience with. Without consent, very little and only ever as a short term "until I can deal with you properly, this will do" manner.

Fiddlers Green

If so, would it affect that object it entered in any appreciable way?

Depends on the spirit, the quality of object, whether the two (spirit and object) are innately resonant or dissonant, the means used to bind them, the quality of ritual and whether it is resonant or dissonant.
I can try next time I'm over to coax something into something for you and let you see if you appreciate the difference.
Or we can see if you appreciate the difference between Solas and Scáth.  

[Fiddlers Green]

CuAnnan

If this is an open question, then absolutely.
There are ways of asking, ways of strongly suggesting, ways of threatening and ways of forcing.
I, personally, find the second two distasteful. They are dissonant.
Spirit binding, with consent, is something that I have some experience with. Without consent, very little and only ever as a short term "until I can deal with you properly, this will do" manner.

All questions I post publicly are open, even if they are directed. 3nodding
Thank you.
Oh, and where do you put blackmailing a spirit?

Quote:

Depends on the spirit, the quality of object, whether the two (spirit and object) are innately resonant or dissonant, the means used to bind them, the quality of ritual and whether it is resonant or dissonant.
I can try next time I'm over to coax something into something for you and let you see if you appreciate the difference.
Or we can see if you appreciate the difference between Solas and Scáth.

I look forward to it, provided no entities are harmed or otherwise maligned. 3nodding

As I think I have told you, my lodge has very strong distastes for direct coercion and enslavement of Geni.  

[CuAnnan]

Fiddlers Green

Oh, and where do you put blackmailing a spirit?

That's, essentially, the same question as 'where do you put blackmailing a person'. It depends on the person and the form of blackmail. As a general rule, not well. It is enslavement.

Fiddlers Green

I look forward to it, provided no entities are harmed or otherwise maligned. 3nodding

Urm... it's me?

Fiddlers Green

As I think I have told you, my lodge has very strong distastes for direct coercion and enslavement of Geni.

As do we.