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 Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:31 pm
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Aquatic_blue Kumiko Fujiwa Aquatic_blue I would say that he had the right to be upset because his religion is important to him and forms on how he lives his life from day to day. He has Catholicism values that he sticks by. His words may not have been the best thing to say, but he had the right to be angry. As a Non-denominational Christian, if I went to someone's house thinking it was a simple Christmas event and that it'd all be okay and then I found out a pagan ritual was involved as well with a fast - I would be upset and would leave immediately. I would be upset and leave because I wasn't told completely about the events and would feel like someone tried to trick me into going so that they could convert my beliefs. In that instance, I would feel as if they didn't care about my feelings or my beliefs and that would hurt a lot - especially if that person was close to me or had been close to me before. Giving blood to something is not a matter to joke about. As they say - blood runs thicker than water. Giving blood is giving part of yourself to something and that can also bind you to something. It's not a funny matter - it's a rather serious one. Wouldn't you be upset if someone invited you over and was going to do something you hated, or something against your personal beliefs whatever they may be and didn't tell you because you may not show up or because they felt that you didn't need to know even though you were participating? It'd hurt, right? That wouldn't be a sincere thing for them to do. Your options now are to talk to him, apologize, and forgive him no matter if he decides to continue to hang out with you or to leave for good - at least you know that you did the right thing. Get to know his feelings and why he was upset if you can and see where you stand in the relationship - whether it's time to call it quits or to continue on with him. You can also just leave it alone until he feels comfortable trying to talk to you. You could leave the issue completely and ignore it, but that doesn't bring a closure to anything. Relationships are all about communication, it's dead without it. I'm sorry I just have to say this. Like Gigi Deveraux said. Your taking the blood thing to far. In my opinion, just because someone didn't get the joke, doesn't mean he/she could say these things. She's aware of the situation of the joke, but that doesn't mean she is one of those people who thinks beliefs don't matter. No I don't ACTUALLY know her, but I understand where she's coming from. I know this has already been addressed but I just wanted to get my point acrossed to, mainly because I'm also Pagan. I understand how this could affect a relationship. You see, jokes are a thing where some people will take as funny and others won't appreciate the effort. If everybody liked every joke that everybody told - we'd all like the same comedians and the same sense of humor. Either way, I am not saying that he didn't get the joke or understand the joke, but rather that he didn't find it funny and instead found it to be rather offensive. Yes, she is aware of the joke she was told, and maybe her type of joke wasn't his type of joke. I don't see it as something that is funny to joke about because I feel that it's a matter that shouldn't be taken lightly. Just as you can connect on the joke issue with her, I can connect with a religious standpoint that Christians or Catholics may not find that exactly funny. It was simply a joke that didn't settle well and perhaps shouldn't have been told. We are entitled to our own opinion so I don't see why this is such a big deal o.o
The reason for this to be serious is because some people will take into offense of what your saying. Yes your titled to your own opinion, and so am I, but try to be in HER shoes. Not his. The joke must have came off lightly, and he must of blown it out of perportion. Either way they are both at fault. He should of understand what his actual feelings about that situation was, and take a better step to execute that problem. But she could have thought about how this process would of unfolded. I'm not taking anyone's side, but I do know how she feels. Plus, not everything is based on religion. Yes you grow up with it, but you don't really have to take it seriously. |
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Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:30 pm
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Aquatic_blue I would say that he had the right to be upset because his religion is important to him and forms on how he lives his life from day to day. He has Catholicism values that he sticks by. His words may not have been the best thing to say, but he had the right to be angry. As a Non-denominational Christian, if I went to someone's house thinking it was a simple Christmas event and that it'd all be okay and then I found out a pagan ritual was involved as well with a fast - I would be upset and would leave immediately. I would be upset and leave because I wasn't told completely about the events and would feel like someone tried to trick me into going so that they could convert my beliefs. In that instance, I would feel as if they didn't care about my feelings or my beliefs and that would hurt a lot - especially if that person was close to me or had been close to me before. Giving blood to something is not a matter to joke about. As they say - blood runs thicker than water. Giving blood is giving part of yourself to something and that can also bind you to something. It's not a funny matter - it's a rather serious one. Wouldn't you be upset if someone invited you over and was going to do something you hated, or something against your personal beliefs whatever they may be and didn't tell you because you may not show up or because they felt that you didn't need to know even though you were participating? It'd hurt, right? That wouldn't be a sincere thing for them to do. Your options now are to talk to him, apologize, and forgive him no matter if he decides to continue to hang out with you or to leave for good - at least you know that you did the right thing. Get to know his feelings and why he was upset if you can and see where you stand in the relationship - whether it's time to call it quits or to continue on with him. You can also just leave it alone until he feels comfortable trying to talk to you. You could leave the issue completely and ignore it, but that doesn't bring a closure to anything. Relationships are all about communication, it's dead without it.
Then thing is, she never tricked him into coming to her house. She explained what it actually was in the same chat that she made the joke in.
I'm not sure if he ever went to her house or not. But she explained everything before hand. There was no trickery involved. He just got mad at her because she made a joke regarding her own religion. And while giving blood may be something horrible to you, in various other religions, it signifies a strong bond or oath. It's like how in some places, a person could place their hands on someone's head and they'll get offended- Because they believe their soul is in their head. It sounds ridiculous to some, but it's how they feel, and it's what they grew up with.
But why should she apologize when she's already apologized profusely? It seems like she apologized more than once, she probably gave him a flood of apologies, and yet he still was a douchenozzle about it. Why should she have to say sorry again? He's the one who needs to say sorry now, she already did. |
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Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:59 pm
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:12 am
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:43 am
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:51 am
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ninja feline Gigi Deveraux ninja feline he said that it wasn't my smarts that attracted him to me *HEADDESK* *HEADDESK**HEADDESK* I know I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, he says I'm not stupid eek well...Ah... sweatdrop he said he like my .....perseverance ..... neutral crying He isn't the best at explaining his feelings which is why I want to speak in person...he knows I'm still upset with him...but I wont see him for weeks... ...sorry....
Yah... I just wish he'd put a little thought into what he's saying, y'know?
I guess this is why I like written communication so much. You have to figure out how to say what you want to say before you say it, instead of blurting out the first thing on the tip of your tongue. |
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:26 am
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Aquatic_blue I would say that he had the right to be upset because his religion is important to him and forms on how he lives his life from day to day. He has Catholicism values that he sticks by. His words may not have been the best thing to say, but he had the right to be angry. As a Non-denominational Christian, if I went to someone's house thinking it was a simple Christmas event and that it'd all be okay and then I found out a pagan ritual was involved as well with a fast - I would be upset and would leave immediately. I would be upset and leave because I wasn't told completely about the events and would feel like someone tried to trick me into going so that they could convert my beliefs. In that instance, I would feel as if they didn't care about my feelings or my beliefs and that would hurt a lot - especially if that person was close to me or had been close to me before. Giving blood to something is not a matter to joke about. As they say - blood runs thicker than water. Giving blood is giving part of yourself to something and that can also bind you to something. It's not a funny matter - it's a rather serious one. Wouldn't you be upset if someone invited you over and was going to do something you hated, or something against your personal beliefs whatever they may be and didn't tell you because you may not show up or because they felt that you didn't need to know even though you were participating? It'd hurt, right? That wouldn't be a sincere thing for them to do. Your options now are to talk to him, apologize, and forgive him no matter if he decides to continue to hang out with you or to leave for good - at least you know that you did the right thing. Get to know his feelings and why he was upset if you can and see where you stand in the relationship - whether it's time to call it quits or to continue on with him. You can also just leave it alone until he feels comfortable trying to talk to you. You could leave the issue completely and ignore it, but that doesn't bring a closure to anything. Relationships are all about communication, it's dead without it.
She was clearly joking. When you're together that long, you get a feel for one another. Besides, she was making a crack at her own religion. A crack at a pretty big misconception on her religion as a whole. He acted like a douche and you don't treat the people you love like that, period. He shouldn't have over reacted. Religion or not, its no excuse to treat a girl like that. Why does she have to walk on egg shells around him when he can say what ever he wants about her religion? Because shes not a christian? His religion is suddenly more superior? Yes, she can apologize for the joke, but there's no reason for him to be disrespecting her like that. Just because he did it in the name of "religion" it doesn't make it okay. Just because hes a christian, this doesn't make him better than her. |
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:35 am
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Vineyard Maiden Aquatic_blue I would say that he had the right to be upset because his religion is important to him and forms on how he lives his life from day to day. He has Catholicism values that he sticks by. His words may not have been the best thing to say, but he had the right to be angry. As a Non-denominational Christian, if I went to someone's house thinking it was a simple Christmas event and that it'd all be okay and then I found out a pagan ritual was involved as well with a fast - I would be upset and would leave immediately. I would be upset and leave because I wasn't told completely about the events and would feel like someone tried to trick me into going so that they could convert my beliefs. In that instance, I would feel as if they didn't care about my feelings or my beliefs and that would hurt a lot - especially if that person was close to me or had been close to me before. Giving blood to something is not a matter to joke about. As they say - blood runs thicker than water. Giving blood is giving part of yourself to something and that can also bind you to something. It's not a funny matter - it's a rather serious one. Wouldn't you be upset if someone invited you over and was going to do something you hated, or something against your personal beliefs whatever they may be and didn't tell you because you may not show up or because they felt that you didn't need to know even though you were participating? It'd hurt, right? That wouldn't be a sincere thing for them to do. Your options now are to talk to him, apologize, and forgive him no matter if he decides to continue to hang out with you or to leave for good - at least you know that you did the right thing. Get to know his feelings and why he was upset if you can and see where you stand in the relationship - whether it's time to call it quits or to continue on with him. You can also just leave it alone until he feels comfortable trying to talk to you. You could leave the issue completely and ignore it, but that doesn't bring a closure to anything. Relationships are all about communication, it's dead without it. Then thing is, she never tricked him into coming to her house. She explained what it actually was in the same chat that she made the joke in. I'm not sure if he ever went to her house or not. But she explained everything before hand. There was no trickery involved. He just got mad at her because she made a joke regarding her own religion. And while giving blood may be something horrible to you, in various other religions, it signifies a strong bond or oath. It's like how in some places, a person could place their hands on someone's head and they'll get offended- Because they believe their soul is in their head. It sounds ridiculous to some, but it's how they feel, and it's what they grew up with. But why should she apologize when she's already apologized profusely? It seems like she apologized more than once, she probably gave him a flood of apologies, and yet he still was a douchenozzle about it. Why should she have to say sorry again? He's the one who needs to say sorry now, she already did.
I never said that she tricked him. I said that if I were in that situation I may "feel" like I was being tricked or not respected. I was looking at the situation from a different angle.
If she explained everything beforehand then that's good. Although, in her original post she said that everything was not explained beforehand:
Quote: He is Catholic and I am not, and I invited him to spend "Christmas" with my family, we were going to do a pagan ritual and fast, which he knew nothing about.
So in this case, I believe it goes beyond the joke. The joke would've been the minor part. The not telling him and being completely honest about all the events taking place is the major thing because in relationships - both people should be able to be completely honest with one another. Thus, I see why the guy would be upset.
Yes, so blood is a strong thing - therefore, it's a serious matter, not exactly a laughing matter. It was a joke that had bad taste according to the guy. We all tell bad jokes from time to time that others don't appreciate. It happens, and if it offended someone - it's still okay to say, "I'm sorry if my joke offended you." because sometimes we unknowingly offend others.
If she's already apologized for it and everything afterwards then that's good. For some people, though, "Sorry" isn't always enough at first and it can take a while before the other person starts talking because they were hurt by the situation. Feelings are important on both sides of this because it is a relationship.
People have their own reasons for acting the way they do, beleving in the things they do, and saying what they do. If a person felt hurt by someone else - it makes sense if the person avoids the one that hurt them because it brings a sense of pain, betrayal, dishonesty, or something else.
I am not saying that she has to do anything. This is a "advice" board and the original poster was asking for advice and that is perfectly okay. It's also okay that not everyone will mention the same advice or see one situation the same way as somebody else.
It sounds a bit bossy to put it in the context of, "He's the one who needs to say sorry now," because he's a human being with his own free will and doesn't have to do anything, either. As people, we can't have control over other people and be mad because someone didn't give us something we thought we deserved such as an apology.
Never thought that offering advice to people over such a matter would end up in everyone getting in your face because the purpose that people ask for "advice" is to see the situation from many different angles and other people's perspectives. Therefore, not all responses are expected to be the same. Also, she can choose which advice to take and which advice not to take. I'm not forcing anything on anybody, I am only trying to help. |
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:35 am
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ninja feline Gigi Deveraux ninja feline he said that it wasn't my smarts that attracted him to me *HEADDESK* *HEADDESK**HEADDESK* I know I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, he says I'm not stupid eek well...Ah... sweatdrop he said he like my .....perseverance ..... neutral crying He isn't the best at explaining his feelings which is why I want to speak in person...he knows I'm still upset with him...but I wont see him for weeks... ...sorry....
You need to get out of there, hun. I hate to say it, but I think you'd be better of with someone who has more respect for you. |
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:44 am
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Kumiko Fujiwa Aquatic_blue Kumiko Fujiwa Aquatic_blue I would say that he had the right to be upset because his religion is important to him and forms on how he lives his life from day to day. He has Catholicism values that he sticks by. His words may not have been the best thing to say, but he had the right to be angry. As a Non-denominational Christian, if I went to someone's house thinking it was a simple Christmas event and that it'd all be okay and then I found out a pagan ritual was involved as well with a fast - I would be upset and would leave immediately. I would be upset and leave because I wasn't told completely about the events and would feel like someone tried to trick me into going so that they could convert my beliefs. In that instance, I would feel as if they didn't care about my feelings or my beliefs and that would hurt a lot - especially if that person was close to me or had been close to me before. Giving blood to something is not a matter to joke about. As they say - blood runs thicker than water. Giving blood is giving part of yourself to something and that can also bind you to something. It's not a funny matter - it's a rather serious one. Wouldn't you be upset if someone invited you over and was going to do something you hated, or something against your personal beliefs whatever they may be and didn't tell you because you may not show up or because they felt that you didn't need to know even though you were participating? It'd hurt, right? That wouldn't be a sincere thing for them to do. Your options now are to talk to him, apologize, and forgive him no matter if he decides to continue to hang out with you or to leave for good - at least you know that you did the right thing. Get to know his feelings and why he was upset if you can and see where you stand in the relationship - whether it's time to call it quits or to continue on with him. You can also just leave it alone until he feels comfortable trying to talk to you. You could leave the issue completely and ignore it, but that doesn't bring a closure to anything. Relationships are all about communication, it's dead without it. I'm sorry I just have to say this. Like Gigi Deveraux said. Your taking the blood thing to far. In my opinion, just because someone didn't get the joke, doesn't mean he/she could say these things. She's aware of the situation of the joke, but that doesn't mean she is one of those people who thinks beliefs don't matter. No I don't ACTUALLY know her, but I understand where she's coming from. I know this has already been addressed but I just wanted to get my point acrossed to, mainly because I'm also Pagan. I understand how this could affect a relationship. You see, jokes are a thing where some people will take as funny and others won't appreciate the effort. If everybody liked every joke that everybody told - we'd all like the same comedians and the same sense of humor. Either way, I am not saying that he didn't get the joke or understand the joke, but rather that he didn't find it funny and instead found it to be rather offensive. Yes, she is aware of the joke she was told, and maybe her type of joke wasn't his type of joke. I don't see it as something that is funny to joke about because I feel that it's a matter that shouldn't be taken lightly. Just as you can connect on the joke issue with her, I can connect with a religious standpoint that Christians or Catholics may not find that exactly funny. It was simply a joke that didn't settle well and perhaps shouldn't have been told. We are entitled to our own opinion so I don't see why this is such a big deal o.o The reason for this to be serious is because some people will take into offense of what your saying. Yes your titled to your own opinion, and so am I, but try to be in HER shoes. Not his. The joke must have came off lightly, and he must of blown it out of perportion. Either way they are both at fault. He should of understand what his actual feelings about that situation was, and take a better step to execute that problem. But she could have thought about how this process would of unfolded. I'm not taking anyone's side, but I do know how she feels. Plus, not everything is based on religion. Yes you grow up with it, but you don't really have to take it seriously.
I suppose what is bothering everybody the most is that I can see the perspective from both sides. I see it from the guy's shoes, yes, and she was asking if he had the right to be upset and everything. I was just answering the question. She was asking about him a lot of the time. I am giving advice how I see it. No one has to like it or appreciate it, and no one has to take it. If you don't like my advice then that's not my issue.
Of course, she knows she may have made a mistake and that happens. She can feel hurt by him because his words could've been chosen more wisely, and he can feel hurt by her because she wasn't completely honest about the events going on. I know it's the fault on both sides and it takes both people to pull the relationship through. I can see her side, and I didn't feel like she was asking for sympathy, but more on if the guy had the right to be upset.
I am not making everything based on religion. I can see how someone would be seriously hurt if they went to a person's house thinking that an event they like was going to take place, when in reality it was an event they hated. That wasn't put into a religious context - it could be something as general as someone who loves animals expects to go to someone's house to help get prepared for an animal fundraiser, but instead the fundraiser is for something else and after they get excited about one thing and that changes, disappointment can occur, right? If someone tells a joke that is unknowingly offensive then that can offend someone else and they may not have realized that before they said it, right? Mistakes can happen and sometimes as people we need to think twice before we say something. That seemed to be the mistake on both parts. |
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:58 am
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Mord Alushar Aquatic_blue I would say that he had the right to be upset because his religion is important to him and forms on how he lives his life from day to day. He has Catholicism values that he sticks by. His words may not have been the best thing to say, but he had the right to be angry. As a Non-denominational Christian, if I went to someone's house thinking it was a simple Christmas event and that it'd all be okay and then I found out a pagan ritual was involved as well with a fast - I would be upset and would leave immediately. I would be upset and leave because I wasn't told completely about the events and would feel like someone tried to trick me into going so that they could convert my beliefs. In that instance, I would feel as if they didn't care about my feelings or my beliefs and that would hurt a lot - especially if that person was close to me or had been close to me before. Giving blood to something is not a matter to joke about. As they say - blood runs thicker than water. Giving blood is giving part of yourself to something and that can also bind you to something. It's not a funny matter - it's a rather serious one. Wouldn't you be upset if someone invited you over and was going to do something you hated, or something against your personal beliefs whatever they may be and didn't tell you because you may not show up or because they felt that you didn't need to know even though you were participating? It'd hurt, right? That wouldn't be a sincere thing for them to do. Your options now are to talk to him, apologize, and forgive him no matter if he decides to continue to hang out with you or to leave for good - at least you know that you did the right thing. Get to know his feelings and why he was upset if you can and see where you stand in the relationship - whether it's time to call it quits or to continue on with him. You can also just leave it alone until he feels comfortable trying to talk to you. You could leave the issue completely and ignore it, but that doesn't bring a closure to anything. Relationships are all about communication, it's dead without it. She was clearly joking. When you're together that long, you get a feel for one another. Besides, she was making a crack at her own religion. A crack at a pretty big misconception on her religion as a whole. He acted like a douche and you don't treat the people you love like that, period. He shouldn't have over reacted. Religion or not, its no excuse to treat a girl like that. Why does she have to walk on egg shells around him when he can say what ever he wants about her religion? Because shes not a christian? His religion is suddenly more superior? Yes, she can apologize for the joke, but there's no reason for him to be disrespecting her like that. Just because he did it in the name of "religion" it doesn't make it okay. Just because hes a christian, this doesn't make him better than her.
Yes, she was joking and probably was unknowingly offensive and that can be apologized for - although the other person may not accept the apology at first. One person could make a joke that seems pretty general and it could offend somebody else if it reminds them of a bad experience or something that they dislike a lot, and sometimes they just don't find it funny because it doesn't seem like a serious matter.
She could make a crack at her own beliefs and that's okay, but that doesn't mean it won't be offensive to someone else if they think of it in a differnt context.
It's normal in relationships to have a little spat from time to time. This can make the relationship even stronger at times, or make both sides stop and think, "Why are we arguing about something this stupid again?" and just forgive each other and move on. Arguments in relationships will happen, no matter how strong the relationship.
In relationships, as human beings, we can say things without thinking or get upset and blow up at the other person. It happens and we may mean it at the time and feel embarrassed or bad about it later.
Once again, some people here have this misconception that I am standing up for the guy because he is Catholic and not standing up for the girl because she is not a Christian. This is simply not true. Because some people see I'm a Christian, I suppose they say, "Oh, you're on the guy's side because the girl isn't a Christian." That's not true, either. It's an overgeneralization on things. People just seem to want to pick at it because I have beliefs of my own.
No, he didn't have the right to say what he said. I am saying that it can't be taken back and he should've chosen his words differently. I have said that in my first post that he should've handled the situation better than he did. We're human, we all get angry sometimes and all know what it's like to get mad at somebody and say things we don't truly mean, but say because we hope it'll be hurtful because we were hurt.
I wasn't aware that the argument between these two had to do with a religious thing and calling her religion stupid. There could've been a basis like that behind it I suppose, but with the information given - we don't truly know if that was his intention behind it at the time or not. It could've been and it may have not been. I have not read anywhere that what he said was done in the name of "religion" because we don't know what he based his words off of. Most people would say he just calls her stupid because of her beliefs because most people don't care about those that have certain religions and feel it easier to pin it on a believer first.
I never said his religion is more superior so I'm not sure where anybody is pulling that information from.
Religious values, no matter who we are or what we believe or call our religion - it shapes our lives, right? So one religion can be offended if one jokes about something so lightly while another person finds it perhaps a serious matter or a matter that isn't funny? If our beliefs influence how we life for day to day whether you're pagan, buddhist, mormon, christian, catholic, agnostic, atheist, etc. then that will also shape things we are offended by as well. Also, on this post it seems like no one was seeing this from the guy's perspective at all so I figured I'd offer that because it's important to see what's going on in another person's shoes.
Also, if she thinks she's been completely disrespected beyond no return and that she wishes not to continue with the relationship, she can end it if she likes. You all seem to hate this guy so much, but why hate him if she seems to love him and wants to try to work this out with him? |
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:00 pm
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ninja feline Gigi Deveraux ninja feline he said that it wasn't my smarts that attracted him to me *HEADDESK* *HEADDESK**HEADDESK* I know I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, he says I'm not stupid eek well...Ah... sweatdrop he said he like my .....perseverance ..... neutral crying He isn't the best at explaining his feelings which is why I want to speak in person...he knows I'm still upset with him...but I wont see him for weeks... ...sorry....
Hopefully you two will get the chance to speak in person soon so a heart-to-heart talk will hopefully be easier for him to express his feelings to you, and both of you can work this out. I hope the weeks go by quick! ^_^ |
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:34 pm
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Aquatic_blue Vineyard Maiden Aquatic_blue I would say that he had the right to be upset because his religion is important to him and forms on how he lives his life from day to day. He has Catholicism values that he sticks by. His words may not have been the best thing to say, but he had the right to be angry. As a Non-denominational Christian, if I went to someone's house thinking it was a simple Christmas event and that it'd all be okay and then I found out a pagan ritual was involved as well with a fast - I would be upset and would leave immediately. I would be upset and leave because I wasn't told completely about the events and would feel like someone tried to trick me into going so that they could convert my beliefs. In that instance, I would feel as if they didn't care about my feelings or my beliefs and that would hurt a lot - especially if that person was close to me or had been close to me before. Giving blood to something is not a matter to joke about. As they say - blood runs thicker than water. Giving blood is giving part of yourself to something and that can also bind you to something. It's not a funny matter - it's a rather serious one. Wouldn't you be upset if someone invited you over and was going to do something you hated, or something against your personal beliefs whatever they may be and didn't tell you because you may not show up or because they felt that you didn't need to know even though you were participating? It'd hurt, right? That wouldn't be a sincere thing for them to do. Your options now are to talk to him, apologize, and forgive him no matter if he decides to continue to hang out with you or to leave for good - at least you know that you did the right thing. Get to know his feelings and why he was upset if you can and see where you stand in the relationship - whether it's time to call it quits or to continue on with him. You can also just leave it alone until he feels comfortable trying to talk to you. You could leave the issue completely and ignore it, but that doesn't bring a closure to anything. Relationships are all about communication, it's dead without it. Then thing is, she never tricked him into coming to her house. She explained what it actually was in the same chat that she made the joke in. I'm not sure if he ever went to her house or not. But she explained everything before hand. There was no trickery involved. He just got mad at her because she made a joke regarding her own religion. And while giving blood may be something horrible to you, in various other religions, it signifies a strong bond or oath. It's like how in some places, a person could place their hands on someone's head and they'll get offended- Because they believe their soul is in their head. It sounds ridiculous to some, but it's how they feel, and it's what they grew up with. But why should she apologize when she's already apologized profusely? It seems like she apologized more than once, she probably gave him a flood of apologies, and yet he still was a douchenozzle about it. Why should she have to say sorry again? He's the one who needs to say sorry now, she already did. I never said that she tricked him. I said that if I were in that situation I may "feel" like I was being tricked or not respected. I was looking at the situation from a different angle. If she explained everything beforehand then that's good. Although, in her original post she said that everything was not explained beforehand: Quote: He is Catholic and I am not, and I invited him to spend "Christmas" with my family, we were going to do a pagan ritual and fast, which he knew nothing about.So in this case, I believe it goes beyond the joke. The joke would've been the minor part. The not telling him and being completely honest about all the events taking place is the major thing because in relationships - both people should be able to be completely honest with one another. Thus, I see why the guy would be upset. Yes, so blood is a strong thing - therefore, it's a serious matter, not exactly a laughing matter. It was a joke that had bad taste according to the guy. We all tell bad jokes from time to time that others don't appreciate. It happens, and if it offended someone - it's still okay to say, "I'm sorry if my joke offended you." because sometimes we unknowingly offend others. If she's already apologized for it and everything afterwards then that's good. For some people, though, "Sorry" isn't always enough at first and it can take a while before the other person starts talking because they were hurt by the situation. Feelings are important on both sides of this because it is a relationship. People have their own reasons for acting the way they do, beleving in the things they do, and saying what they do. If a person felt hurt by someone else - it makes sense if the person avoids the one that hurt them because it brings a sense of pain, betrayal, dishonesty, or something else. I am not saying that she has to do anything. This is a "advice" board and the original poster was asking for advice and that is perfectly okay. It's also okay that not everyone will mention the same advice or see one situation the same way as somebody else. It sounds a bit bossy to put it in the context of, "He's the one who needs to say sorry now," because he's a human being with his own free will and doesn't have to do anything, either. As people, we can't have control over other people and be mad because someone didn't give us something we thought we deserved such as an apology. Never thought that offering advice to people over such a matter would end up in everyone getting in your face because the purpose that people ask for "advice" is to see the situation from many different angles and other people's perspectives. Therefore, not all responses are expected to be the same. Also, she can choose which advice to take and which advice not to take. I'm not forcing anything on anybody, I am only trying to help.
I know you're only trying to help, and I am too. Thanks for pointing the other part out though, I read it wrong. 0_0
I'm not trying to get in your face though, I thought I was pointing something out. XD But what I meant by "He needs to say sorry now" is that it's his just his turn. See, I thought you were trying to force her to say sorry even more, and to forgive him. Any advice is still advice though, so it's not like anyone's advice is bad. It's just that we all have different opinions on the matter, and they all clash. THAT'S why you're getting so many people talking to you, it's not that people want to fight, it's because they want to explain their piece on it and collaborate with you. |
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:19 pm
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Aquatic_blue Mord Alushar Aquatic_blue I would say that he had the right to be upset because his religion is important to him and forms on how he lives his life from day to day. He has Catholicism values that he sticks by. His words may not have been the best thing to say, but he had the right to be angry. As a Non-denominational Christian, if I went to someone's house thinking it was a simple Christmas event and that it'd all be okay and then I found out a pagan ritual was involved as well with a fast - I would be upset and would leave immediately. I would be upset and leave because I wasn't told completely about the events and would feel like someone tried to trick me into going so that they could convert my beliefs. In that instance, I would feel as if they didn't care about my feelings or my beliefs and that would hurt a lot - especially if that person was close to me or had been close to me before. Giving blood to something is not a matter to joke about. As they say - blood runs thicker than water. Giving blood is giving part of yourself to something and that can also bind you to something. It's not a funny matter - it's a rather serious one. Wouldn't you be upset if someone invited you over and was going to do something you hated, or something against your personal beliefs whatever they may be and didn't tell you because you may not show up or because they felt that you didn't need to know even though you were participating? It'd hurt, right? That wouldn't be a sincere thing for them to do. Your options now are to talk to him, apologize, and forgive him no matter if he decides to continue to hang out with you or to leave for good - at least you know that you did the right thing. Get to know his feelings and why he was upset if you can and see where you stand in the relationship - whether it's time to call it quits or to continue on with him. You can also just leave it alone until he feels comfortable trying to talk to you. You could leave the issue completely and ignore it, but that doesn't bring a closure to anything. Relationships are all about communication, it's dead without it. She was clearly joking. When you're together that long, you get a feel for one another. Besides, she was making a crack at her own religion. A crack at a pretty big misconception on her religion as a whole. He acted like a douche and you don't treat the people you love like that, period. He shouldn't have over reacted. Religion or not, its no excuse to treat a girl like that. Why does she have to walk on egg shells around him when he can say what ever he wants about her religion? Because shes not a christian? His religion is suddenly more superior? Yes, she can apologize for the joke, but there's no reason for him to be disrespecting her like that. Just because he did it in the name of "religion" it doesn't make it okay. Just because hes a christian, this doesn't make him better than her. Yes, she was joking and probably was unknowingly offensive and that can be apologized for - although the other person may not accept the apology at first. One person could make a joke that seems pretty general and it could offend somebody else if it reminds them of a bad experience or something that they dislike a lot, and sometimes they just don't find it funny because it doesn't seem like a serious matter. She could make a crack at her own beliefs and that's okay, but that doesn't mean it won't be offensive to someone else if they think of it in a differnt context. It's normal in relationships to have a little spat from time to time. This can make the relationship even stronger at times, or make both sides stop and think, "Why are we arguing about something this stupid again?" and just forgive each other and move on. Arguments in relationships will happen, no matter how strong the relationship. In relationships, as human beings, we can say things without thinking or get upset and blow up at the other person. It happens and we may mean it at the time and feel embarrassed or bad about it later. Once again, some people here have this misconception that I am standing up for the guy because he is Catholic and not standing up for the girl because she is not a Christian. This is simply not true. Because some people see I'm a Christian, I suppose they say, "Oh, you're on the guy's side because the girl isn't a Christian." That's not true, either. It's an overgeneralization on things. People just seem to want to pick at it because I have beliefs of my own. No, he didn't have the right to say what he said. I am saying that it can't be taken back and he should've chosen his words differently. I have said that in my first post that he should've handled the situation better than he did. We're human, we all get angry sometimes and all know what it's like to get mad at somebody and say things we don't truly mean, but say because we hope it'll be hurtful because we were hurt. I wasn't aware that the argument between these two had to do with a religious thing and calling her religion stupid. There could've been a basis like that behind it I suppose, but with the information given - we don't truly know if that was his intention behind it at the time or not. It could've been and it may have not been. I have not read anywhere that what he said was done in the name of "religion" because we don't know what he based his words off of. Most people would say he just calls her stupid because of her beliefs because most people don't care about those that have certain religions and feel it easier to pin it on a believer first. I never said his religion is more superior so I'm not sure where anybody is pulling that information from. Religious values, no matter who we are or what we believe or call our religion - it shapes our lives, right? So one religion can be offended if one jokes about something so lightly while another person finds it perhaps a serious matter or a matter that isn't funny? If our beliefs influence how we life for day to day whether you're pagan, buddhist, mormon, christian, catholic, agnostic, atheist, etc. then that will also shape things we are offended by as well. Also, on this post it seems like no one was seeing this from the guy's perspective at all so I figured I'd offer that because it's important to see what's going on in another person's shoes. Also, if she thinks she's been completely disrespected beyond no return and that she wishes not to continue with the relationship, she can end it if she likes. You all seem to hate this guy so much, but why hate him if she seems to love him and wants to try to work this out with him?
Just the way your post came of was that you seemed to be defending him as a Christian. Also, it feels that if the rolls were reversed, you wouldn't passionately defend her as you are him. Perhaps if you worded things differently, confusion can be avoided. Its just how you came off. |
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:39 am
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Mord Alushar Aquatic_blue Mord Alushar Aquatic_blue I would say that he had the right to be upset because his religion is important to him and forms on how he lives his life from day to day. He has Catholicism values that he sticks by. His words may not have been the best thing to say, but he had the right to be angry. As a Non-denominational Christian, if I went to someone's house thinking it was a simple Christmas event and that it'd all be okay and then I found out a pagan ritual was involved as well with a fast - I would be upset and would leave immediately. I would be upset and leave because I wasn't told completely about the events and would feel like someone tried to trick me into going so that they could convert my beliefs. In that instance, I would feel as if they didn't care about my feelings or my beliefs and that would hurt a lot - especially if that person was close to me or had been close to me before. Giving blood to something is not a matter to joke about. As they say - blood runs thicker than water. Giving blood is giving part of yourself to something and that can also bind you to something. It's not a funny matter - it's a rather serious one. Wouldn't you be upset if someone invited you over and was going to do something you hated, or something against your personal beliefs whatever they may be and didn't tell you because you may not show up or because they felt that you didn't need to know even though you were participating? It'd hurt, right? That wouldn't be a sincere thing for them to do. Your options now are to talk to him, apologize, and forgive him no matter if he decides to continue to hang out with you or to leave for good - at least you know that you did the right thing. Get to know his feelings and why he was upset if you can and see where you stand in the relationship - whether it's time to call it quits or to continue on with him. You can also just leave it alone until he feels comfortable trying to talk to you. You could leave the issue completely and ignore it, but that doesn't bring a closure to anything. Relationships are all about communication, it's dead without it. She was clearly joking. When you're together that long, you get a feel for one another. Besides, she was making a crack at her own religion. A crack at a pretty big misconception on her religion as a whole. He acted like a douche and you don't treat the people you love like that, period. He shouldn't have over reacted. Religion or not, its no excuse to treat a girl like that. Why does she have to walk on egg shells around him when he can say what ever he wants about her religion? Because shes not a christian? His religion is suddenly more superior? Yes, she can apologize for the joke, but there's no reason for him to be disrespecting her like that. Just because he did it in the name of "religion" it doesn't make it okay. Just because hes a christian, this doesn't make him better than her. Yes, she was joking and probably was unknowingly offensive and that can be apologized for - although the other person may not accept the apology at first. One person could make a joke that seems pretty general and it could offend somebody else if it reminds them of a bad experience or something that they dislike a lot, and sometimes they just don't find it funny because it doesn't seem like a serious matter. She could make a crack at her own beliefs and that's okay, but that doesn't mean it won't be offensive to someone else if they think of it in a differnt context. It's normal in relationships to have a little spat from time to time. This can make the relationship even stronger at times, or make both sides stop and think, "Why are we arguing about something this stupid again?" and just forgive each other and move on. Arguments in relationships will happen, no matter how strong the relationship. In relationships, as human beings, we can say things without thinking or get upset and blow up at the other person. It happens and we may mean it at the time and feel embarrassed or bad about it later. Once again, some people here have this misconception that I am standing up for the guy because he is Catholic and not standing up for the girl because she is not a Christian. This is simply not true. Because some people see I'm a Christian, I suppose they say, "Oh, you're on the guy's side because the girl isn't a Christian." That's not true, either. It's an overgeneralization on things. People just seem to want to pick at it because I have beliefs of my own. No, he didn't have the right to say what he said. I am saying that it can't be taken back and he should've chosen his words differently. I have said that in my first post that he should've handled the situation better than he did. We're human, we all get angry sometimes and all know what it's like to get mad at somebody and say things we don't truly mean, but say because we hope it'll be hurtful because we were hurt. I wasn't aware that the argument between these two had to do with a religious thing and calling her religion stupid. There could've been a basis like that behind it I suppose, but with the information given - we don't truly know if that was his intention behind it at the time or not. It could've been and it may have not been. I have not read anywhere that what he said was done in the name of "religion" because we don't know what he based his words off of. Most people would say he just calls her stupid because of her beliefs because most people don't care about those that have certain religions and feel it easier to pin it on a believer first. I never said his religion is more superior so I'm not sure where anybody is pulling that information from. Religious values, no matter who we are or what we believe or call our religion - it shapes our lives, right? So one religion can be offended if one jokes about something so lightly while another person finds it perhaps a serious matter or a matter that isn't funny? If our beliefs influence how we life for day to day whether you're pagan, buddhist, mormon, christian, catholic, agnostic, atheist, etc. then that will also shape things we are offended by as well. Also, on this post it seems like no one was seeing this from the guy's perspective at all so I figured I'd offer that because it's important to see what's going on in another person's shoes. Also, if she thinks she's been completely disrespected beyond no return and that she wishes not to continue with the relationship, she can end it if she likes. You all seem to hate this guy so much, but why hate him if she seems to love him and wants to try to work this out with him? Just the way your post came of was that you seemed to be defending him as a Christian. Also, it feels that if the rolls were reversed, you wouldn't passionately defend her as you are him. Perhaps if you worded things differently, confusion can be avoided. Its just how you came off.
I was not defending because of my faith, but because I see how someone with that specific religion would be upset at the situation and figured I'd offer my insight in hopes that it would help.
I figured she'd want more insight into how he felt because she asked in the poll if he had the right to be upset or said what he did. Sometimes it helps to understand the other person's view point in order to deal with the situation correctly while thinking of why they might have said what they did or have been upset.
I can't help if people take what I word out of context. If a person chooses to then that's how they will see it no matter what. |
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