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 Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:37 am
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:22 am
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Fushigi na Butterfly Personally, I never turn to tarot to tell the future, for myself or others. I use it to tell the present, if that makes sense. It's more of a way to focus on a certain aspect of a problem and maybe figure out how to approach it.
My problem with the tarrot is you don't know whats talking to you. Kinda like the quija boards, open doorways like that are never good.
But anyway....
You talk about Christianity like its an emotion. From what I see in your posts is that, you don't feel the emotional high or rapture that alot of christians associate with their faith so you don't think you have any.
I've never had that emotional response to my faith. But I still have faith, I still know God is there. When I doubt I look at my life, all of it, and I examin the connections. That is where I find God. You may not see him right now next to you, helping you. But if you look back at the events you will see his hand prints on every good thing, and his footsteps right alongside yours.
Everyone has their time in the valley's of doubt, all it does is make those high points of faith all that more spectacular. |
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 8:51 am
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Fushigi na Butterfly Wow. I hadn't actually thought of any of what I'm going through as growth. I'd been kinda feeling like it was the opposite of growth. I know I have definitely grown in other ways, and I wonder if my new philosophies on life won't disagree with the value of Jesus' teachings just by their very nature. In the past year or so, I've turned into a bit of a feminist with a strong propensity for preaching on the merits of sexual freedom, which, so far as I know, is sort of not taught in Christianity (sex is for marriage only). As selfish as it seems, I don't know that I could give up a lot of what I believe in favor of more Biblical teachings. I don't believe women should take a backseat role in everyday matters, and particularly in relationships, I don't believe sexuality is something to be repressed and kept only in someone else's "proper context," I don't believe that homosexuality, in theory or in practice, is sinful, and I don't believe that other people who have never heard of Jesus are set up for eternal damnation. A lot of this goes against either what the Bible teaches, or what other people say the Bible teaches, and it makes me just want to throw it all away for the sake of avoiding argument and say it doesn't matter what someone else says you should believe -- just do what's in your heart. So I don't know if you'd still necessarily call that growth.
When I went to the New Year's Eve service with my friend, I looked around at everyone and those with their hands raised and eyes closed, and even the band on stage that was pretty much rockin' out in the name of Jesus and ... they all just seemed so ... silly. confused It's like there's a total disconnect. I don't get it anymore. It's not me, it's not who I am, and I don't know how to get back in a way that is me and who I am. When I've cried to God about it, I don't feel the same comfort or peace I used to when I'd go to Him. It's just nothing. Silence. An empty void. It's not even so much a wall like it has been in the past. The wall is gone, but I'm not finding anything on the other side.
I know my boyfriend will be a huge help to me in this respect; I think he gets it a little better than I do. Unfortunately though, it is my only motivation. If it wasn't for him, I'd probably still be plodding along doing my own thing. I have no other motivation of my own to give this God thing another try. D:
And you may wanna make ready your newspaper. confused
I'm not quite sure how to phrase what I want to say to you, so I guess I'll just go right into it.
As for your doubts as to where women should be, I completely agree that women should be equal to men in all things (I think for the most part they are, it just a few things here and there, and thats only in consideration to America)
As for your doubts about sexuality, I have my own views on that. I don't think sex should be confined to marriage, however, I do believe you shouldn't go that far in a relationship unless you are planning to stay with that person for the rest of your life. To me going that far is a commitment, just like marriage. I reject the idea that sex should be done just because you care about someone deeply, but are open to the idea that maybe something could go wrong in your future and the two of you separate. The reason for this is that at its core going that far is really for one thing, having a child. Biologically speaking, we were never designed to be with another person like that just because we wanted to, it was a commitment to create another life, and were willing to be with that other person because we loved them and wanted to raise that life with them. To me, that's a lifelong commitment. Even on Birth Control there is still a chance of having a child, (points to self) and I guess that's what it really comes down to for me. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you can't go that far because you love someone, I'm saying its because you love someone in a way that is that deep that you can go that far, but again these are just my opinions. What I'm trying to say is that you shouldn't be worried about having doubts about the typical view of relationships, as there are a lot of Christians who do.
In your overall doubting, I ask this, what, precisely, are you doubting? An earlier post mentioned that you seem to be waiting for an emotional feeling to show that you love and have faith in God. If that is true, then I think that another post may be right and you've simply just grown spiritually. Allow me to explain, I consider myself Christian (I'm sorry if this feels like I keep turning it back to me, I'm just trying offer my own views on your situation, and I feel it necessary to give examples.) but I hardly ever go to church, I mean maybe a couple or a few times a year. I also don't really feel an emotional rapture when I talk to God, for me, I simply know that God is there and is listening, and that's enough. I know that I love God and Jesus with all my heart, and that enough. Just like you, when I see others with their eyes closed and hands raised I don't feel anything, nothing at all. I'm glad they are able to express their faith in such a way, and I say go for it, but I don't feel the need to do that in order to express my faith in God. In other words, just because you no longer feel the need to raise your hands or close your eyes does not mean you do not have faith in God.
Honestly, just ask yourself this, Do you love God and Jesus? Do you believe they are there, whether or not something has happened in your life to make you think they are is irrelevant. If the answer to those two questions is yes, and to show your faith in God you try to live your life and treat others with respect and toleration, and care for others through your actions, then I would say you have just as much faith in God as anyone else, regardless of what other people say, or what other people think the Bible says.
Sorry for this post being so long, feel free to continue here or PM me if you want to talk some more. |
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 9:07 am
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Naristar Fushigi na Butterfly Personally, I never turn to tarot to tell the future, for myself or others. I use it to tell the present, if that makes sense. It's more of a way to focus on a certain aspect of a problem and maybe figure out how to approach it.
But anyway....
You talk about Christianity like its an emotion. From what I see in your posts is that, you don't feel the emotional high or rapture that alot of christians associate with their faith so you don't think you have any.
I've never had that emotional response to my faith. But I still have faith, I still know God is there. When I doubt I look at my life, all of it, and I examin the connections. That is where I find God. You may not see him right now next to you, helping you. But if you look back at the events you will see his hand prints on every good thing, and his footsteps right alongside yours.
Everyone has their time in the valley's of doubt, all it does is make those high points of faith all that more spectacular.`Though thy crest be shorn and shaven, thou,' I said, `art sure no craven.
Ghastly grim and ancient raven wandering from the nightly shore -
`Though thy crest be shorn and shaven, thou,' I said, `art sure no craven.
Ghastly grim and ancient raven wandering from the nightly shore -
The thing with oujia boards is that they're a popular child's board game. If playing with them opens doors to "demons" and other otherwordly beings then so does playing monopoly. And as someone said, the origin of Tarot cards started out as a playing cards deck not divination. It wasn't until the 17th century that they became used for divination. So again if you think a bunch of cards can open a "door" for "demons" then so can poker cards. :s
@Fushigi: Sometimes doubting your faith can be a good learning and enlightening experience that can actually strengthen your faith. For the past 20 years (which is my whole life) I've been in and out of Christianity, I've always doubted by faith, however, it normally gave me the inspiration I needed to move forward, even if I left Christianity behind. (Jesus always goes for the people who seem to stray not the ones with the overly religious stick up their keister >.>). Heck I still doubt my faith even now, and it's ultimately caused my to understand it more, and undoubtedly strengthen it.
Tell me what thy lordly name is on the Night's Plutonian shore!'
Quoth the raven, `Nevermore.'
Tell me what thy lordly name is on the Night's Plutonian shore!'
Quoth the raven, `Nevermore.' |
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High-functioning Businesswoman
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 4:51 pm
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@Lisa Faye: Wow, I'm really sorry to hear about your losses. sad We understand, life happens. I hope you're able to resolve everything and find a good outlet and processing source for your emotions. We won't kick you out. smile
@Requiem Arc: Everything you say is pretty much true. I'd never considered that what I was looking for in my faith was an emotional response. It's just what I've always been used to, and when I hear other Christians talk about the peace and comfort and joy they feel, I examine my life now and I realize I have none of that. That, of course, could be because I'm not taking any active steps myself to feel that though, so. I guess, in a way, I have experienced some growth. I had a louder faith, and now I have a quieter faith. But I also struggle with what I do and don't believe. Some days I really do feel just like an atheist, and there's some comfort in that. Most days I believe in "something," but I can't quite put my finger on what. Other days I have complete faith in the existence of God and Jesus, and everything He did for us. It's hard. It's ever-evolving and generally evasive. confused
@Ravynne: True. I've never had a problem with doubting and questioning, even in myself. It's just that it's never gone on for so long, so it's getting to be a little unnerving, you know what I mean?
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:14 pm
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Fushigi na Butterfly @Lisa Faye: Wow, I'm really sorry to hear about your losses. sad We understand, life happens. I hope you're able to resolve everything and find a good outlet and processing source for your emotions. We won't kick you out. smile
@Requiem Arc: Everything you say is pretty much true. I'd never considered that what I was looking for in my faith was an emotional response. It's just what I've always been used to, and when I hear other Christians talk about the peace and comfort and joy they feel, I examine my life now and I realize I have none of that. That, of course, could be because I'm not taking any active steps myself to feel that though, so. I guess, in a way, I have experienced some growth. I had a louder faith, and now I have a quieter faith. But I also struggle with what I do and don't believe. Some days I really do feel just like an atheist, and there's some comfort in that. Most days I believe in "something," but I can't quite put my finger on what. Other days I have complete faith in the existence of God and Jesus, and everything He did for us. It's hard. It's ever-evolving and generally evasive. confused
@Ravynne: True. I've never had a problem with doubting and questioning, even in myself. It's just that it's never gone on for so long, so it's getting to be a little unnerving, you know what I mean? `Though thy crest be shorn and shaven, thou,' I said, `art sure no craven.
Ghastly grim and ancient raven wandering from the nightly shore -
Yeah I know. Feels like a hole you can never get out of. I had a depressive state last week and couldn't get myself out of. But you have to realize that no matter what your friends, family (well if your family isn't exactly supportive then your friends who are like family), Jesus and God have your back. Also deep thinking about the situation and the use of hypothetical what if situations tends to help. And when all else fails: cry. Cry your eyes out. It's a good biological restart button smile
Tell me what thy lordly name is on the Night's Plutonian shore!'
Quoth the raven, `Nevermore.' |
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High-functioning Businesswoman
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 9:41 pm
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 9:50 pm
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Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:51 am
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Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 11:34 am
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Fushigi na Butterfly
@Requiem Arc: Everything you say is pretty much true. I'd never considered that what I was looking for in my faith was an emotional response. It's just what I've always been used to, and when I hear other Christians talk about the peace and comfort and joy they feel, I examine my life now and I realize I have none of that. That, of course, could be because I'm not taking any active steps myself to feel that though, so. I guess, in a way, I have experienced some growth. I had a louder faith, and now I have a quieter faith. But I also struggle with what I do and don't believe. Some days I really do feel just like an atheist, and there's some comfort in that. Most days I believe in "something," but I can't quite put my finger on what. Other days I have complete faith in the existence of God and Jesus, and everything He did for us. It's hard. It's ever-evolving and generally evasive. confused
I don't think you should ever stop questioning your beliefs, or the beliefs of others, I think its why God gave us the minds to do it with. smile
as for doubting your faith though, I still ask the same question, what exactly are you doubting? The existence of God and Jesus? If so, why? What is it that is propelling your doubt? If your willing to accept that rather than having a loud faith you have a quiet faith, what exactly are you looking for?
(notice all the questions? Lol.) |
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High-functioning Businesswoman
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Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 12:17 pm
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I'm doubting the validity of Christian beliefs. I'm doubting the existence of God. I'm doubting the divinity of Jesus. Why? I have no idea. It's like I woke up one morning and thought, "What if none of this is true?" and it kept festering inside me until I was forced to make peace with the doubt, because I couldn't prove it one way or the other. So now I'm on the fence.
Another part of the struggling comes from my lack of motivation to commit. I think if I were to just jump right in, feet first, and really be serious, I'd probably be okay. But I'm sort of okay where I am, and aside from missing the relationship I had with God, and the peace and comfort I felt from Him, I don't see any reason to change things, because ultimately, my lifestyle hasn't really changed all that much.
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Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:26 pm
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zz1000zz Lord Maxdom As for the mention of Tarot cards, they always had a spiritual connection. In fact, Poker Cards were originally created by Gypsies so they can practice their beliefs without persecuting governments finding out, and it sort of developed into a very popular game. This isn't true at all. Tarot cards existed for hundreds of years without any spiritual connection, and "Poker Cards" doesn't even make sense as a phrase. Poker is a game which uses cards, but the cards used are not specific to poker. Poker itself didn't come about until the 1700s, centuries after the cards used in it first existed. As for gypsies, they had no particular role in the creation of poker, tarot cards or modern playing cards. I have no idea where you got these ideas from, but there is no truth in them.
You have your beliefs in the origin of the cards then, as I have mine. |
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Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:29 pm
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Fushigi na Butterfly I'm doubting the validity of Christian beliefs. I'm doubting the existence of God. I'm doubting the divinity of Jesus. Why? I have no idea. It's like I woke up one morning and thought, "What if none of this is true?" and it kept festering inside me until I was forced to make peace with the doubt, because I couldn't prove it one way or the other. So now I'm on the fence.
Another part of the struggling comes from my lack of motivation to commit. I think if I were to just jump right in, feet first, and really be serious, I'd probably be okay. But I'm sort of okay where I am, and aside from missing the relationship I had with God, and the peace and comfort I felt from Him, I don't see any reason to change things, because ultimately, my lifestyle hasn't really changed all that much.
I view it as a good thing that you are questioning your beliefs. If you can't question something which you hold as true, you'd just be believing blindly. |
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Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:25 pm
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Fushigi na Butterfly I'm doubting the validity of Christian beliefs. I'm doubting the existence of God. I'm doubting the divinity of Jesus. Why? I have no idea. It's like I woke up one morning and thought, "What if none of this is true?" and it kept festering inside me until I was forced to make peace with the doubt, because I couldn't prove it one way or the other. So now I'm on the fence.
Another part of the struggling comes from my lack of motivation to commit. I think if I were to just jump right in, feet first, and really be serious, I'd probably be okay. But I'm sort of okay where I am, and aside from missing the relationship I had with God, and the peace and comfort I felt from Him, I don't see any reason to change things, because ultimately, my lifestyle hasn't really changed all that much.
In respect to doubting the existence of God and the divinity of Jesus I would ask how your going about it, for instance, are you just stuck on the question "what if?" or, do you have concerns that you can research and try to solve logically? |
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Posted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:15 pm
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Lord Maxdom zz1000zz Lord Maxdom As for the mention of Tarot cards, they always had a spiritual connection. In fact, Poker Cards were originally created by Gypsies so they can practice their beliefs without persecuting governments finding out, and it sort of developed into a very popular game. This isn't true at all. Tarot cards existed for hundreds of years without any spiritual connection, and "Poker Cards" doesn't even make sense as a phrase. Poker is a game which uses cards, but the cards used are not specific to poker. Poker itself didn't come about until the 1700s, centuries after the cards used in it first existed. As for gypsies, they had no particular role in the creation of poker, tarot cards or modern playing cards. I have no idea where you got these ideas from, but there is no truth in them. You have your beliefs in the origin of the cards then, as I have mine.
This isn't a matter of "beliefs." Everything I said is based upon simple facts which are easy to verify. I have no problem with people holding different beliefs, and I don't think people need to argue points if they don't want to.
However, you cannot contradict basic facts and justify it by saying you're entitled to your own beliefs. |
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