'Fake Vegetarians'

[A Touch of Evil]

I would love so much to be vegetarian, but I still live with my parents and they aren't really helping when grocery shopping. I'm forced to eat meat and whatnot and I hate it. Sometimes I feel like such a smuck because I want to major in environmental science/wildlife biology, I just wanna save all the animals, nurse them back to health, set them all free, and destroy every single factory out there that harms animals. crying crying So for now, I can't be vegetarian, and I most definitely don't call myself one.

The only meat I'm having trouble substituting, is fish. I love shrimp and and sushi and the raw stuff...so I don't know what to eat in place of them and have it taste just as good. I can easily substitute chicken, beef, pork, and turkey, with tofu, boca ( heart I LOVE Boca), eggplants (like instead of chicken parmesan, I love having eggplant parmesean, it's soooo delicious), garden patties, and vegetarian chili beans or black beans or something. Oh and I LOVE using large portabello mushrooms as patties for burgers.

What I find annoying is, "You don't have to be vegetarian all the time, you can sometimes be vegetarian, and other times not be one." stressed stressed That one annoys me.  

[Blame Hoffmann]

I have never understood the whole being a vegetarian but being able to eat fish thing. Like I know they are called a Pescetarian or whatever. It shouldn't be a side branch of vegetarianism because your still eating meat. It obviously defeats the whole purpose.

People that don't eat beef/chicken for the taste but eat fish shouldn't have a title. They obviously don't do it for the animal cruelty aspect.  

[Ailinea]

Lostkeyintr0

People that don't eat beef/chicken for the taste but eat fish shouldn't have a title. They obviously don't do it for the animal cruelty aspect.

... So that makes them less of a person? Christ, they're already cutting down on the major forms of the meat industry: pork, beef, and chicken. Yes, fish are animals too, but not ALL vegetarians (or pescatarians) do it for ethical reasons. Some of us like to watch our health as well and find fish to be a suitable alternative to other meats. Get off your damn soapbox.  

[A Touch of Evil]

Lostkeyintr0

I have never understood the whole being a vegetarian but being able to eat fish thing. Like I know they are called a Pescetarian or whatever. It shouldn't be a side branch of vegetarianism because your still eating meat. It obviously defeats the whole purpose.

I don't consider Pescetarian is a side branch of Vegetarianism, because I agree, fish are meaty animals too.

Lostkeyintr0

People that don't eat beef/chicken for the taste but eat fish shouldn't have a title. They obviously don't do it for the animal cruelty aspect.

If someone doesn't eat meat because of the taste, then that's perfectly okay. Not everyone who is Veg has ethical qualms about eating meat. Lot's of us don't eat meat to be healthier, or to simply lose wieght. Fish happens to be healthier than beef or pork. If someone claims the title of Pescetarian, it doens't necessarily mean they support animal cruelty. Maybe they are forced to eat fish for a medical reason.

So really, no need to pass judgement on an entire group of people before knowing the whole story......I'm not trying to attack you, I'm just saying......that's how the holocaust started. >_< whee  

[LorienLlewellyn]

I could be wrong here, but I don't think Lostkey was necessarily trying to offend anyone. I think she was basically saying that if someone eats fish, there's a good chance they just cut the other meats out of their diet to cut down on their saturated fat intake. And that means there is a good chance that their diet is just a diet and little/nothing more, whereas vegetarianism and veganism are usually serious lifestyle choices with their roots in health, the environment, and compassion. So while eating fish and no other meat is definitely better than a full omni diet, it doesn't really seem deserving of it's own title to go under or alongside vegetarianism/veganism either.  

[Ailinea]

Yeah, I came back to edit my post so it sounded less hostile, I realize that I may have overreacted a bit. My apologies. sad

It's my opinion though that just because one still eats meat, even if it is just fish, that doesn't make them less deserving of a "title." It's just a word. I guess, in retrospect, it's not much of a big deal on the other end either. It just frustrates me to no end that some veg*ns think they're hot stuff and automatically assume they're the authority on everything and are always right. Lostkey's comment came across to me as pretentious and unneeded, but hey, we're all entitled to our opinions.

I could counteract by saying that vegetarians still consume dairy and eggs and are therefore still supporting the unethical meat industry. Does that make them less deserving of a title?  

[LorienLlewellyn]

Good point. It kind of bugs me when people use titles in...unconventional ways (for example when people say, "I'm a vegetarian, I just eat chicken sometimes." sweatdrop ). But, like you said, it really is just a title, just a word. No word completely sums any of us up, so there are going to be a lot of gray areas or overlapping.

And whether vegetarians are truly deserving of a title would make a good debate!

The word "deserving" implies a certain amount of morality. And while I believe a vegetarian diet is far more moral than an omni diet, I don't think it's nearly as moral as a vegan diet. So is it "good enough" for a title?

But titles aren't given to only the most moral people; they're given out to make it easier to describe people or what they do. "Vegetarian" is easier than saying, "Doesn't eat meat or animal fat." And "pescetarian" is easier to say than, "Eats fish but no other animal meats or fats."

But it also seems a bit weird to have a title for every little thing. I mean, what about people who eat chicken but no other meats? Do we really need a title for them? What about people who eat whole grains but not white breads? Or people who are allergic to strawberries? Or people who don't drink soda? Or people who don't like green beans? Etc. Do we really need a word to sum up everyone's diet? When do the titles stop being simpler than just describing what you do and don't eat?

And would we be better off without the titles anyway? Most people in this guild have probably suffered through a groan, an eye roll, or a PETA joke when the words "vegetarian" or "vegan" came out of their mouth because along with titles come stereotypes.

I'll stop there because I can see myself debating it in circles/forever. xp  

[Ailinea]

Ha! I love philosophy and how it can make one's mind asplode. And yes, the title thing can be rather cumbersome. When people ask, lately I've just been telling them "I'm cutting back on my meat consumption." So far it's actually receiving positive responses. biggrin  

[eveejoystar]

So I just got in a little argument in the forums.
Some guy made a thread asking why people hated vegetarians, and in his speech he said he was a vegetarian who occasionally ate burgers.
I know every little part counts, I even said that. But I basically went on to say that he wasn't a vegetarian and that I hate when people claim they're something they're not, b/c it gets omnivores to think we eat fish, chicken, etc. He's basically an omnivore who doesn't eat meat that much.
Well, some girl went on to basically say I was being rude, and that vegetarian doesn't mean we're part of an "elite group" who can deem people worthy. scream
I never claimed I was. I just didn't think he should call himself something he's not b/c of the omnivore reason above. Like I said, cutting back on meat helps, but if you call yourself a vegetarian when your not, omnivores won't get the right facts about vegetarians.
I don't want my friends thinking it's okay if I occasionally eat a burger.
"Oh, come one. It's only one burger."  

[Short Melancholic]

The whole no fish thing has been the hardest on me. I love the taste of it, and it's supposed to be good for you and all, so occasionally, I do fail and eat some fish =p I think I will be a pescetarian, and I know a fish is still an animal and I should be fighting for its rights too but... I dunno, I'm still considering. No other meat for me though. If that's any consolation sweatdrop  

[winnlovesyou]

I would have no problem with pescetarians (did I spell that right?) if they actually said what they were, instead of claiming that they were vegetarian.  

[Banvivrie]

I think a lot of the time it boils down to a general lack of knowledge. There are plenty of people who may not know that the word "pescetarian" even exists. They might struggle with how to define their diet and end up landing on "vegetarian" simply because they lack a better word. There's a lot of bad information floating around that many new (especially young) veg*ns are forced to wade through.

I like to think that most people make mistakes like these due to lack of knowledge. It's worth correcting, but be gentle about it.  

[Blame Hoffmann]

Ailinea

Lostkeyintr0

People that don't eat beef/chicken for the taste but eat fish shouldn't have a title. They obviously don't do it for the animal cruelty aspect.

... So that makes them less of a person? Christ, they're already cutting down on the major forms of the meat industry: pork, beef, and chicken. Yes, fish are animals too, but not ALL vegetarians (or pescatarians) do it for ethical reasons. Some of us like to watch our health as well and find fish to be a suitable alternative to other meats. Get off your damn soapbox.

If you eat fish which is a meat don't run around and call yourself a vegetarian. I guess it annoys REAL vegetarians. If you eat fish call yourself a pescetarian not a vegetarian.  

[MC Ride is my Daddy]

I'm vegetarian. My mom knows this.
Yet, she keeps trying to get me to eat fish claiming that
"Most vegetarians and vegans eat fish."
She also thinks that the only thing I'm cutting out of my diet is meat. Not Quite.
*sigh* i guess I'm going to have to keep refusing to eat fish.  

[Banvivrie]

I know that earlier I said such things were probably mistakes and misinformation in most cases, but I can't help but wonder how many parents say things like that just to get their child to conveniently eat what the rest of the family eats.

I've gotten that before too, and it felt an awful lot like the classic "If you make faces, your face will freeze that way". sweatdrop