The rise and fall of William Shatner.

[Matt Pniewski]

xXSuperWhateverXx

Farthingale

You guys are pretty harsh on poor ol' Bill. He's worked a long time (remember, Star Trek wasn't his first low-paying gig) and brought a lot of people a lot of joy. He's got a great sense of humour, is charming, and able to make fun of himself.

I watched the Mind Meld documentary where he and Nimoy discussed stuff and they both agreed that a lot of the so-called animosity between the cast members was hyped up out of proportion.

It seems strange to me to come on a Star Trek guild and start to pull apart William Shatner. Just sayin'.

I wasn't really being harsh on Bill, Most of the bashing was Matt anyway.
To be honest, if he never portrayed the role of Kirk. The character wouldn't have been as awesome ^-^.

Well, yeah.

He helped shape Star Trek into what it is.

But, you know, I liked Mel Gibson in Lethal Weapon, but that doesn't make him any less of a nutcase, does it? Tom Cruise has been consistantly great in everything, but do i ahve to like him because he kicked a** in Minority report?


Shatner is not a good person. He's not a good actor, but he had presence, and he created this image of Captain Kirk that was Iconic.  

[xXSuperWhateverXx]

Matt Pniewski

xXSuperWhateverXx

Farthingale

You guys are pretty harsh on poor ol' Bill. He's worked a long time (remember, Star Trek wasn't his first low-paying gig) and brought a lot of people a lot of joy. He's got a great sense of humour, is charming, and able to make fun of himself.

I watched the Mind Meld documentary where he and Nimoy discussed stuff and they both agreed that a lot of the so-called animosity between the cast members was hyped up out of proportion.

It seems strange to me to come on a Star Trek guild and start to pull apart William Shatner. Just sayin'.

I wasn't really being harsh on Bill, Most of the bashing was Matt anyway.
To be honest, if he never portrayed the role of Kirk. The character wouldn't have been as awesome ^-^.

Well, yeah.

He helped shape Star Trek into what it is.

But, you know, I liked Mel Gibson in Lethal Weapon, but that doesn't make him any less of a nutcase, does it? Tom Cruise has been consistantly great in everything, but do i ahve to like him because he kicked a** in Minority report?


Shatner is not a good person. He's not a good actor, but he had presence, and he created this image of Captain Kirk that was Iconic.

Yeah I know.

I don't like Orlando Bloom but he believe he did a great job in the LOTR trilogy.

Although when it comes to Shatner.
I'm not really sure.. Like some people say he's awesome, some just think he is a jerk. So, to be honest, I don't know what to think. Even though he is a crappy actor, and director. I read his book, Star Trek Academy: Collision Course and I really liked it.  

[Andy Magnuseth]

I know this might not be EXACTLY relevant to our point of discussion, but when I first read this topic, this was the first thing that came to mind:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HU2ftCitvyQ  

[xXSuperWhateverXx]

Miki Ishikawa

I know this might not be EXACTLY relevant to our point of discussion, but when I first read this topic, this was the first thing that came to mind:

]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HU2ftCitvyQ

xD I saw the clip but not the actual remix.  

[The Angry Therapist]

No, what really sucks was that they didn't invite him to be in the newest Trek Movie, but Leonard Nemoy was. That doesn't make them rivals, but WHO THE HELL DOESN'T WANT WILLIAM SHATNER IN THEIR STAR TREK MOVIE!!!!!!  

[xXSuperWhateverXx]

platsdevil

No, what really sucks was that they didn't invite him to be in the newest Trek Movie, but Leonard Nemoy was. That doesn't make them rivals, but WHO THE HELL DOESN'T WANT WILLIAM SHATNER IN THEIR STAR TREK MOVIE!!!!!!

Yeah I know,
but I heard he got offered a cameo in this movie but never accepted.
I wonder why?  

[Matt Pniewski]

platsdevil

No, what really sucks was that they didn't invite him to be in the newest Trek Movie, but Leonard Nemoy was. That doesn't make them rivals, but WHO THE HELL DOESN'T WANT WILLIAM SHATNER IN THEIR STAR TREK MOVIE!!!!!!

Nimoy is a better actor. And, Spock is more recognizable than Kirk.


They could have had him do the last narration in the film, but the Kirk Character wouldn't seem to fit, and Spock is more fitting for story and marketing purposes.  

[xXSuperWhateverXx]

Matt Pniewski

platsdevil

No, what really sucks was that they didn't invite him to be in the newest Trek Movie, but Leonard Nemoy was. That doesn't make them rivals, but WHO THE HELL DOESN'T WANT WILLIAM SHATNER IN THEIR STAR TREK MOVIE!!!!!!

Nimoy is a better actor. And, Spock is more recognizable than Kirk.


They could have had him do the last narration in the film, but the Kirk Character wouldn't seem to fit, and Spock is more fitting for story and marketing purposes.

Yeah I was thinking the same thing with the narration at the end.
Or maybe like a flashback thing where they put clips of TOS in it.  

[Doctor Bonez]

Well, the thing is, when one becomes known so well as a character from a show it becomes hard for people to see him as anything else. Kinda like Vic Mignogna is best known as Edward Elric in FullMetal Alchemist.
Many fans had a hard time seeing him as anyone else in the anime buisness because he did so well as Ed people could only see him as that character.
Now that is not to say the actor would not do well as anyone else, but when you are type casted, it makes getting different roles VERY hard.
Even James Doohan said himself on an interview, producers and agents and such would say things like "I don't want a Scotsman in my movie." Even though he has done other accents adn roles as, say, a German or Frenchman.
It's just plain old type casting.  

[xXSuperWhateverXx]

Doctor Bonez

Well, the thing is, when one becomes known so well as a character from a show it becomes hard for people to see him as anything else. Kinda like Vic Mignogna is best known as Edward Elric in FullMetal Alchemist.
Many fans had a hard time seeing him as anyone else in the anime buisness because he did so well as Ed people could only see him as that character.
Now that is not to say the actor would not do well as anyone else, but when you are type casted, it makes getting different roles VERY hard.
Even James Doohan said himself on an interview, producers and agents and such would say things like "I don't want a Scotsman in my movie." Even though he has done other accents adn roles as, say, a German or Frenchman.
It's just plain old type casting.

Yeah,
that's why Doohan found it hard to get other roles after Star Trek.  

[Tear Away These Faces]

Matt Pniewski

Dust Dancer

Sweetycow

I read somewhere that he does get job offers, but he doesn't like the roles. He got so used to be number one and now they want to cast him in small supporting roles and he doesn't want that.

Right now I can't remember where I read it. It was in a magazine...

I agree, and with a point to add to that.

He's so full of himself that he can't accept anything else. That's my conclusion based on how his fellow TOS costars would describe him.

Doohan and Takei being especially hateful.... Takei is a damn decent guy, who I met while filming at the pride parade... So I'll take his side...


Look, rise and fall? He never had a rise..... He was a terrible actor, writer, and director who thinks he's "The Shatner." But really, he's not. He's luckily got the charisma needed to make his performances enjoyable, but never believable.

I agree, he never struck me as a good actor. In fact when I watch it with family, everyone laughs and says "Oh look another shat attack"

 

[Matt Pniewski]

Doctor Bonez

Well, the thing is, when one becomes known so well as a character from a show it becomes hard for people to see him as anything else. Kinda like Vic Mignogna is best known as Edward Elric in FullMetal Alchemist.Many fans had a hard time seeing him as anyone else in the anime buisness because he did so well as Ed people could only see him as that character.

Despite that, he has a fan following and an IMDB list a mile long.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0586003/

So maybe the problem isn't as general as you think, merely your own impressions. Then again, as I've noticed with fans of any variety, they seem to be under the impression that people think like them. Don't feel I'm criticizing you, because as a Star Trek geek, a Doctor Who nerd (from the time you still had to watch Tom Baker late night on PBS in America), and a REFORMED anime fan, I'm guilty of the same thing.

Quote:

Now that is not to say the actor would not do well as anyone else, but when you are type casted, it makes getting different roles VERY hard.
Even James Doohan said himself on an interview, producers and agents and such would say things like "I don't want a Scotsman in my movie." Even though he has done other accents adn roles as, say, a German or Frenchman.
It's just plain old type casting.

Most actors have a love hate relationship with these Roles. Look at Nimoy. He has a great amount of affection for his character, but also dreads the fact that he was always going to be Spock, and he could never break out of that.

Of course, something has to be said for Personal Talent. Doohan, Takei, Kelley... All great actors. But then we have Patrick Stewart, who never got typecast, because he showed a much wider range than anyone else who had ever been attached to Star Trek. Brent Spiner's versatility kept him in acting roles for some time. And that's they key. What kept them from being typecast. What made them more successful, while Shatner (though successful) was just a punchline.

They had Range. They could show it better than anyone else. Spiner didn't have to suffer through typecasting until years after the show ended.  

[Nerthus_water_nymph]

To me the fued with William Shatner and George Takei seems to be mostly be hot air that was added long ago as a means to keep there name in the spotlight. For example take the roast of William Shatner, George Takei came to the show, yes I know that a roast is celebrities insulting other celebrities but you don't get a roast for being a bad actor it's seen as a sort of honor and if they truly hated each other I doubt that Takei would give Shatner any source of satisfaction of appearing on any thing with him again especialy for a quote unquote honor. Takei even hugged Shatner, albeit a stiff hug but a hug none the less, now think about that for a sec if I held a grudge with someone for 40 years there is absolutly no way I'm going to hug the guy, if I did any thing it would be a handshake a very stiff handshake at that. Also I've seen some of the interveiws where both Shatner and Takei talked about the wedding situation and all that was really said could be chalked up to he said she said. Now if you remember the grudge that has supposidly lasted for 40 years, allowing for plenty of time to increase in strength I think something else would've been said nothing truly malicious has ever been said, by now I think we would have seen more than he said she said arguements and a few minor mean words, besides any of this both have said in past interveiws that the media has blown the fued out of proportion which is highly probable because the media controls what we know about the world and it has been known to brodcast certain ways trying to enforce a belief onto their veiwers  

[xXSuperWhateverXx]

@Nerthus_water_nymph.

Yeah I've heard about the wedding and seen the roast. I also agree with you on the feud. There is no way Takei hates Shatner if he gave him that hug on the roast. Although, I think we can agree that he may not like Shatner much. A lot of the people who worked with him found him difficult to work with. The only people on TOS who didn't have any difficulty working with him were Kelley and Nimoy.  

[Nerthus_water_nymph]

xXSuperWhateverXx

@Nerthus_water_nymph.

Yeah I've heard about the wedding and seen the roast. I also agree with you on the feud. There is no way Takei hates Shatner if he gave him that hug on the roast. Although, I think we can agree that he may not like Shatner much. A lot of the people who worked with him found him difficult to work with. The only people on TOS who didn't have any difficulty working with him were Kelley and Nimoy.

I agree with you that he's hard to work with you can see it through his own words in the book Star Trek Movie Memories. I haven't read all the way through it yet, I've just skimmed it, I'm going to read it after my psychology final.