Generalized Chaos Magick, An Attempt at [Under Construction]

[Iosonos]

Hmm, am I insane?! yeah, I think I am. I just realized I forgot how many different aspects I'm going to have to talk about.

well, I guess i'll go over some of the larger takes on it, ie
the Kaos-Babalon current take (Joel Biroco)
the IOS (If anyone has been in the order, or knows more about it, i'd love to know, i'm working on mostly older sources).
the Discordians
Chaosism
Anti-IOS movement (Zee List, and other BBS-like movements).  

[TeaDidikai]

Iosonos

Hmm, am I insane?! yeah, I think I am. I just realized I forgot how many different aspects I'm going to have to talk about.

well, I guess i'll go over some of the larger takes on it, ie
the Kaos-Babalon current take (Joel Biroco)
the IOS (If anyone has been in the order, or knows more about it, i'd love to know, i'm working on mostly older sources).
the Discordians
Chaosism
Anti-IOS movement (Zee List, and other BBS-like movements).

Why would you lump the Discordians under Chaos Magic in general? Would it not be closer to think of it as being akin to Zen?  

[Deandriea]

TeaDidikai

Iosonos

Hmm, am I insane?! yeah, I think I am. I just realized I forgot how many different aspects I'm going to have to talk about.

well, I guess i'll go over some of the larger takes on it, ie
the Kaos-Babalon current take (Joel Biroco)
the IOS (If anyone has been in the order, or knows more about it, i'd love to know, i'm working on mostly older sources).
the Discordians
Chaosism
Anti-IOS movement (Zee List, and other BBS-like movements).

Why would you lump the Discordians under Chaos Magic in general? Would it not be closer to think of it as being akin to Zen?

Zen for roundeyes is one of our nicknames, but you know, Eris and her Chaos means we at least merit mention. I corresponded with a Discordian who casts pentagons of protection using a plastic cafeteria spork.  

[TeaDidikai]

Deandriea

TeaDidikai

Iosonos

Hmm, am I insane?! yeah, I think I am. I just realized I forgot how many different aspects I'm going to have to talk about.

well, I guess i'll go over some of the larger takes on it, ie
the Kaos-Babalon current take (Joel Biroco)
the IOS (If anyone has been in the order, or knows more about it, i'd love to know, i'm working on mostly older sources).
the Discordians
Chaosism
Anti-IOS movement (Zee List, and other BBS-like movements).

Why would you lump the Discordians under Chaos Magic in general? Would it not be closer to think of it as being akin to Zen?

Zen for roundeyes is one of our nicknames, but you know, Eris and her Chaos means we at least merit mention. I corresponded with a Discordian who casts pentagons of protection using a plastic cafeteria spork.

What I am wondering is why Discordia is classed under Chaos Magic when any religion can have Chaos Magicians within it.

Case in point: Tsuzuki, the Mormon-Catholic Chaos Mage.  

[Tsuzuki]

TeaDidikai

Deandriea

TeaDidikai

Iosonos

Hmm, am I insane?! yeah, I think I am. I just realized I forgot how many different aspects I'm going to have to talk about.

well, I guess i'll go over some of the larger takes on it, ie
the Kaos-Babalon current take (Joel Biroco)
the IOS (If anyone has been in the order, or knows more about it, i'd love to know, i'm working on mostly older sources).
the Discordians
Chaosism
Anti-IOS movement (Zee List, and other BBS-like movements).

Why would you lump the Discordians under Chaos Magic in general? Would it not be closer to think of it as being akin to Zen?

Zen for roundeyes is one of our nicknames, but you know, Eris and her Chaos means we at least merit mention. I corresponded with a Discordian who casts pentagons of protection using a plastic cafeteria spork.

What I am wondering is why Discordia is classed under Chaos Magic when any religion can have Chaos Magicians within it.

Case in point: Tsuzuki, the Mormon-Catholic Chaos Mage.

You make the assumption that I am not also a Discordian, and that it is not through Discordian ideas that I am able to pull this whole thing off.

Interestingly enough, one of the founders of the Discordian movement also had a Mormon background. Suddenly, the modern religious landscape gets very interesting.  

[TeaDidikai]

Tsuzuki

You make the assumption that I am not also a Discordian, and that it is not through Discordian ideas that I am able to pull this whole thing off.

Interestingly enough, one of the founders of the Discordian movement also had a Mormon background. Suddenly, the modern religious landscape gets very interesting.

You missed my assertion.

Discordia as a theology is just like any other theology, not a subsect of Chaos Magic, but a paradigm one can use within Chaos Magic.  

[Tsuzuki]

TeaDidikai

Tsuzuki

You make the assumption that I am not also a Discordian, and that it is not through Discordian ideas that I am able to pull this whole thing off.

Interestingly enough, one of the founders of the Discordian movement also had a Mormon background. Suddenly, the modern religious landscape gets very interesting.

You missed my assertion.

Discordia as a theology is just like any other theology, not a subsect of Chaos Magic, but a paradigm one can use within Chaos Magic.

True to an extent. Though they do have a history together. The first paradigm pirates were Discordians, and the two movements have been in bed together almost from the beginning.

Discordianism itself would be classed as a metaparadigm, just as chaoism is. If chaos magic is a computer, Discordianism is the most popular bundled operating system. Of course, this leads into the whole eclectic vs systematic trends among chaos magicians as noted by Joshua Wetzel in The Paradigmal Pirate.  

[TeaDidikai]

Tsuzuki

True to an extent. Though they do have a history together. The first paradigm pirates were Discordians, and the two movements have been in bed together almost from the beginning.

Discordianism itself would be classed as a metaparadigm, just as chaoism is. If chaos magic is a computer, Discordianism is the most popular bundled operating system. Of course, this leads into the whole eclectic vs systematic trends among chaos magicians as noted by Joshua Wetzel in The Paradigmal Pirate.

By that measure though- Zen is the most popular bundled operating system.

Which is why I have issues with the way the classification is going. wink  

[Tsuzuki]

TeaDidikai

Tsuzuki

True to an extent. Though they do have a history together. The first paradigm pirates were Discordians, and the two movements have been in bed together almost from the beginning.

Discordianism itself would be classed as a metaparadigm, just as chaoism is. If chaos magic is a computer, Discordianism is the most popular bundled operating system. Of course, this leads into the whole eclectic vs systematic trends among chaos magicians as noted by Joshua Wetzel in The Paradigmal Pirate.

By that measure though- Zen is the most popular bundled operating system.

Which is why I have issues with the way the classification is going. wink

Regardless of what anyone says, Discordianism is not "Zen for roundeyes."  

[TeaDidikai]

Tsuzuki

Regardless of what anyone says, Discordianism is not "Zen for roundeyes."

While I find the phrasing offensive, the idea of Discordianism or Zen as a tool for breaking mental patterns in order to buck an "enforced" paradigm doesn't seem unreasonable to me at all.  

[Tsuzuki]

TeaDidikai

Tsuzuki

Regardless of what anyone says, Discordianism is not "Zen for roundeyes."

While I find the phrasing offensive, the idea of Discordianism or Zen as a tool for breaking mental patterns in order to buck an "enforced" paradigm doesn't seem unreasonable to me at all.

Zen is good for seeing clearly, while Discordianism and chaoism are good for breaking mental patterns. They are about the same as a pair of glasses and a hammer. Discordianism would be the type of hammer that makes funny noises when you hit things, while chaoism is silent.  

[TeaDidikai]

Tsuzuki

Zen is good for seeing clearly, while Discordianism and chaoism are good for breaking mental patterns.

Can you please support your claim that Zen Riddles are merely for seeing clearly and not breaking mental patterns?  

[Tsuzuki]

TeaDidikai

Tsuzuki

Zen is good for seeing clearly, while Discordianism and chaoism are good for breaking mental patterns.

Can you please support your claim that Zen Riddles are merely for seeing clearly and not breaking mental patterns?

The goal of Zen Buddhism is the attainment of the mental pattern known as "enlightenment" through the use of said riddles. Discordianism and chaoism mock that mental state and claim that it is an illusion as well. Discordianism and chaoism have more to do with postmodernism than anything related to what the Buddha taught, though they do cannibalize some of his ideas and twist them around. They're not Zen, and their aims are completely different.  

[TeaDidikai]

Tsuzuki

The goal of Zen Buddhism is the attainment of the mental pattern known as "enlightenment" through the use of said riddles.

To be honest, this- even with my limited understanding of Eastern Theology- strikes me as being akin to people saying all Christendom is Roman Catholic.

Most of the Zen Buddhists I know are Taoists as well- except not because to be a Taoist is to not be a Taoist.

Quote:

Discordianism and chaoism have more to do with postmodernism than anything related to what the Buddha taught, though they do cannibalize some of his ideas and twist them around.

I think there is also an assumption of universal practice and understanding of Sutras amongsts Zen Buddhists.