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Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 8:57 am
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Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 7:40 pm
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Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:18 am
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Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 1:13 pm
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Posted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:34 am
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Posted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:49 am
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Posted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 10:23 am
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Posted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 11:49 am
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TeaDidikai Loona Wynd Are you talking about the Sabbats? Yep. To the one that I serve This is a common theme. I don't know the cultural origins of the Sabbats (Samhain, Imbolc, Lugnasha, and Beltaine). I feel that if the Sabbat meanings honored by Penczak are completely different from the original context that they should have new names that relate to the actual lore beings used and not just the popular name.I will give my all
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Posted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 11:57 am
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Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 7:40 am
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Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 8:34 am
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Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:27 pm
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TeaDidikai But you are in a position to abstain from racism by not indulging it with your time or money. How is the tradition racist? I'll give you that it engages in cultural misapropriation, but I dont see how that is racist. Perhaps you could show me how this fits into your definition of racist?
TeaDidikai This is akin to saying that the N~ word has two meanings, the one tied to what regular modern Racists use and the one that is tied to what the old plantation owners used. And that somehow regular modern racists aren't as bad, because after all, they don't own slaves. To the one that I serve Thats not what I was trying to say at all. That is twisting my words. What I was trying to say is that to me there are two holidays with the same name. One of which needs a new name as it is not the same and one of which is a cultural festival.
Again I don't see the racisim.I will give my all
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Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 7:22 pm
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Loona Wynd TeaDidikai But you are in a position to abstain from racism by not indulging it with your time or money. How is the tradition racist? I'll give you that it engages in cultural misapropriation, but I dont see how that is racist. Perhaps you could show me how this fits into your definition of racist? Cultural misappropriation is a practice that is based on the idea that one's idea of cultural items being open to others outside that culture is superior to a culture/race's idea of cultural items being closed to outsiders. It's racially presumptuous to what belongs to another cultural identity just because you feel it should be open to all.
Racism is discriminatory or privileged behaviour directed towards a race or cultural identity. Privileged behaviour between an African American and a black immigrant from Kenya would be considered racism even though they are of the same race.
TeaDidikai This is akin to saying that the N~ word has two meanings, the one tied to what regular modern Racists use and the one that is tied to what the old plantation owners used. And that somehow regular modern racists aren't as bad, because after all, they don't own slaves. To the one that I serve Thats not what I was trying to say at all. That is twisting my words. No, that was an example to show that your logic doesn't work, as either way, the usage of those names is insulting.Quote: What I was trying to say is that to me there are two holidays with the same name. The usage of the closed culture names for rites practiced by outsiders is insulting in any circumstance, whether you feel it is or not.
I may feel that "******" can colloquially mean "fool" but whatever my opinion is, it's still going to be found offensive.Quote: One of which needs a new name as it is not the same and one of which is a cultural festival. Why must the two be related? Why not have one's own rite with one's own name and one's own cultural markings?
Claiming that it's related to some festival or other that doesn't belong to you is not only insultingly presumptuous, it's lazy.Quote: Again I don't see the racisim. I will give my all Do you now?
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Posted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 8:34 am
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To the one that I serve Gho the Girl Cultural misappropriation is a practice that is based on the idea that one's idea of cultural items being open to others outside that culture is superior to a culture/race's idea of cultural items being closed to outsiders. It's racially presumptuous to what belongs to another cultural identity just because you feel it should be open to all. I guess I know now why the tradition could be considered racist. Thank you for the clarification.
Gho the Girl Racism is discriminatory or privileged behaviour directed towards a race or cultural identity. Privileged behaviour between an African American and a black immigrant from Kenya would be considered racism even though they are of the same race. I guess I thought racisim was derogetory...Gho the Girl No, that was an example to show that your logic doesn't work, as either way, the usage of those names is insulting. I think of all the sabbats that way.Gho the Girl The usage of the closed culture names for rites practiced by outsiders is insulting in any circumstance, whether you feel it is or not. I agree it's wrong. At the same time I still see that there are two holidays on that date, one whose name needs to be changed (but realisticaly wont change because people cling to false ideas because they are familliar).
Gho the Girl Why must the two be related? Did I say they were?Gho the Girl Why not have one's own rite with one's own name and one's own cultural markings? Which is the point I am arguing as well. I want the neo-pagan holiday to have a new name based on the rites and rituals of these traditions.
Gho the Girl Claiming that it's related to some festival or other that doesn't belong to you is not only insultingly presumptuous, it's lazy. Which is why I agree they should have different names as they are different. I don't have enough of my own sources and research yet to show my teacher that they are different and should be called something else. When I do have that information I will be writing something and publishing it in some form.To the one that I serve Yes. I had a misunderstanding of all the forms of racisim.
Though I will say that if Penczak is racisist then so is the majority of the authors out there.
I will give my all I will give my all
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