Grammar: It won't kill you! / Thread titles

[[ D i z z y ! ]]

I've been noticing lately that the amount of literacy used amongst the forums has been going a bit downhill, and I ask the members to try their best to keep their spelling and grammar up to par.

I find it a bit difficult when I cannot completely understand a post because I cannot read it, and I'd hate to have people being greatly misunderstood because of bad grammar.

As stated on the front page, as well as in the guild guide, decent grammar skills (aka. around that of a 7th grader and above) is manditory in this guild. Having sloppy posts and thread titles makes the guild seem a little sloppy, but we want it clean and easy to read. So members, please take the time to capitalize your I's and re-read your posts. (More than likely) you have all the time in the world, so take that time to make our guild more readable and have better understanding for each other. 3nodding

As well, I'm going to put a little pressure on members to not have thread titles that are misleading to what you're actually trying to say. This also falls under how members can understand and respond to your posts. Having misleading titles may lead to much arguing or ranting, especially if people reply to your topic before reading the first post-- automatically assuming the thread topic was that of which was in the title.

Finally, large and difficult to read fonts are almost as difficult and annoying to read as extremely bad grammar. Please be respective of others around you and use a more readable font. Thank you.

If anyone would like to voice any comments, concerns, or suggestions, please post!  

[_Built_to_Offend_666]

i hope its alright that i say an opposing side, just because I see this issue somewhat frequently. I know I don't contribute that often, but its usually cause i am busy or something with life.

Language is a means of communication, a method of conveying ideas to others. As long as you can get the concept you are trying to create across to the other person, you are successful. Now for exmpale any wrod taht bigens and edns whit the smae ltteers as its sospused to and cntaoins smae appx nmuber of ltteers, you can srcmble ltteers in btewen and stll usullay get genral mssage acorss. Sure it looks a little less decent, but thats the person's choice who types like that. They often do look ignorant, and usually they accept that choice. When you say "(more often than not) you have all the time in the world", you are often wrong. People like me, and countless other freinds I know, only get on computer for 20 minute intervals. And usually have some other main task on computer other than foruming, AND usually have some sort of IM open too. This limits time, and usually increases stree rate. As a result the poster usually (99% of the time) doesn't check over their post. They simply don't have time. Also, switching from IM to foruming can be confusing too. Ppl off10 dont REliz they type lyk this when they post cus they r used 2 it. But the overall message generally gets across more than 50% of the time. And if its not, you can ask to explain what they said, and people like me are completely alright with re-wording it if it comes to that.

i can understand the obsessive-compulsive urge people get when they see that, humans in general are usually all to some degree have OCD. But to expect everyone to have the same leisure online as everyone else is kind of a 2-dimensional look at the situation.  

[MortSanglant]

It's in issues such as that that you should take up some sort of typing excerises which will allow you to type quickly and properly.

 

[_Built_to_Offend_666]

mortsanglant

It's in issues such as that that you should take up some sort of typing excerises which will allow you to type quickly and properly.

Again, you assume people have time to just sit for hours on the computer everyday. Most people only get like one or two chances on computer, and as I explained earlier, are usually parcially preoccupied during that time. Some people only have access to computer once or twice a week. Are they susposed to devote what little time they have on the computer practicing to type to the standards of people they don't even really know? You all take for granted that you have alot if time you get to spend on computer. So much so you've almost faded into a level of bigotry to those who don't type to your standards. Isn't it a commonly accepted beleif for those this guild is dedicated to that judging others is an ignorant thing to do? Why are we all of a sudden judging and trying to change those who are what they are. Lack of computer time isn't the only reason. Some people are dislectic[sp?] and get confused easily when switching from Instant messaging to foruming ever couple seconds, some people natural get confused when doing that same action as well without being dislectic[sp?]. Some people simply type fast and make typos. I, personally, make typos almost every other sentence. And even during those few times when I am able to proof-read my work, I often don't catch at least 70% errors as others do. This is a problem I know that affects a huge mammoth sum of the majority, almost every person I know is affected by this. And sometimes people truly don't care enough about other internet freinds they'll never meet to meet their judgmental bloated standards. Are you really going to say your hang-up is so damn important that you'd cast others off and/or attempt to change parts of their lifestyle because of it? I mean, communication is successful as long as the message has gotten across, everything outside that is simply obsessive-compulsive hangups. And OCD is a personal problem.  

[zz1000zz]

Errors and mistakes have never been an issue in this guild. We do not expect perfect spelling and grammar. What is expected is for all members to type in a fashion that allows everyone to understand what you are posting. For this, decent grammar and spelling are important. However, nobody will insult you for spelling a word correctly, or not using commas. The problem is when people make posts where the lack of grammar/spelling make it difficult to understand.

On another topic, i do not capitalize my i's. While doing so is commonly accepted as "correct," i see no reason to do so. While the rule made sense originally, now it is just an outdated tradition. There is no reason to capitalize the letter "i" now, other than that is what is always done.

As a lexicography major, i cannot in good conscience ascribe to such a rule.  

[[ D i z z y ! ]]

zz1000zz

Errors and mistakes have never been an issue in this guild. We do not expect perfect spelling and grammar. What is expected is for all members to type in a fashion that allows everyone to understand what you are posting. For this, decent grammar and spelling are important. However, nobody will insult you for spelling a word correctly, or not using commas. The problem is when people make posts where the lack of grammar/spelling make it difficult to understand.

On another topic, i do not capitalize my i's. While doing so is commonly accepted as "correct," i see no reason to do so. While the rule made sense originally, now it is just an outdated tradition. There is no reason to capitalize the letter "i" now, other than that is what is always done.

As a lexicography major, i cannot in good conscience ascribe to such a rule.

@ zz1001zz: In my time here, I have found it to bit a bit difficult to understand others.
I do not expect perfect spelling and grammar, just simply understandable wording. The guild doesn't turn anyone down in join requests, or has (I don't think) banned someone who has used extremely bad grammar. This is simply a reminder that grammar is infact, completely important in proper communcation, being that Gaia is strictly text-only.
Sometimes mis-translated words, or mis-understood words, makes people jump to conclusions. This results in many a bad things.

And about "i"'s; for one to capitalize every other letter in her grammar-perfected paragraph, why not the i? Haha, but I know where you're coming from. Its a habit, and if others can understand you, then it deems not necessary, right? Ah, well, this is where guild tidyness and such might come into play. However, I'm going to let you to use your own discretion with your little "i"'s. Anyways, thanks for your opinion. c:

@ Built to Offend: for Poelpe to tpye lkie tihs, would be illogical in most sense, and if your anywhere near unable to interpret it, that is where the real problems arise. You say, "still usually get the general message" and what if you don't? What if someone is dyslexic or something? How do they read that? For the lovely minority of the population who cannot read that (be it 30% or less), then even reading such posts would put them at a disadvantage.

And I understand where you're coming from on the time factor. Most kids (and adults) only get spare time on the computer, limited by real life tasks and such. But there is a one-minute per post thing on Gaia. Meaning, after you post once, you have a minute to browse, wait for an answer, what have you. It's also an advantage in the fact you can post again right away after posting once, giving you a minute to type. This is however, not always the case.

And for those of us using IM, MSN, etc. It's kind of understandable, but its also something you can do about-- you can adjust to quick typing style between windows. Or, of course, you can just be completely literate and have your friends wait an extra 6 seconds on msn/IM for a perfect grammarized message. And like you said, more than 50% of the time. So what about the other less-than-50%. Ah. Exactly.

I'm no grammar nazi (well, maybe at night) but all I expect of others is, in the least, a decent understandable message. A 90% understandablity ratio, maybe less. Whether or not this includes little i's or not, that's personal choice. Thanks for your input!  

[zz1000zz]

The Toast said NO

zz1000zz

Errors and mistakes have never been an issue in this guild. We do not expect perfect spelling and grammar. What is expected is for all members to type in a fashion that allows everyone to understand what you are posting. For this, decent grammar and spelling are important. However, nobody will insult you for spelling a word correctly, or not using commas. The problem is when people make posts where the lack of grammar/spelling make it difficult to understand.

On another topic, i do not capitalize my i's. While doing so is commonly accepted as "correct," i see no reason to do so. While the rule made sense originally, now it is just an outdated tradition. There is no reason to capitalize the letter "i" now, other than that is what is always done.

As a lexicography major, i cannot in good conscience ascribe to such a rule.

@ zz1001zz: In my time here, I have found it to bit a bit difficult to understand others.
I do not expect perfect spelling and grammar, just simply understandable wording. The guild doesn't turn anyone down in join requests, or has (I don't think) banned someone who has used extremely bad grammar. This is simply a reminder that grammar is infact, completely important in proper communcation, being that Gaia is strictly text-only.
Sometimes mis-translated words, or mis-understood words, makes people jump to conclusions. This results in many a bad things.

And about "i"'s; for one to capitalize every other letter in her grammar-perfected paragraph, why not the i? Haha, but I know where you're coming from. Its a habit, and if others can understand you, then it deems not necessary, right? Ah, well, this is where guild tidyness and such might come into play. However, I'm going to let you to use your own discretion with your little "i"'s. Anyways, thanks for your opinion. c:

@ Built to Offend: for Poelpe to tpye lkie tihs, would be illogical in most sense, and if your anywhere near unable to interpret it, that is where the real problems arise. You say, "still usually get the general message" and what if you don't? What if someone is dyslexic or something? How do they read that? For the lovely minority of the population who cannot read that (be it 30% or less), then even reading such posts would put them at a disadvantage.

And I understand where you're coming from on the time factor. Most kids (and adults) only get spare time on the computer, limited by real life tasks and such. But there is a one-minute per post thing on Gaia. Meaning, after you post once, you have a minute to browse, wait for an answer, what have you. It's also an advantage in the fact you can post again right away after posting once, giving you a minute to type. This is however, not always the case.

And for those of us using IM, MSN, etc. It's kind of understandable, but its also something you can do about-- you can adjust to quick typing style between windows. Or, of course, you can just be completely literate and have your friends wait an extra 6 seconds on msn/IM for a perfect grammarized message. And like you said, more than 50% of the time. So what about the other less-than-50%. Ah. Exactly.

I'm no grammar nazi (well, maybe at night) but all I expect of others is, in the least, a decent understandable message. A 90% understandablity ratio, maybe less. Whether or not this includes little i's or not, that's personal choice. Thanks for your input!

Ah, i was rather vague there. The first part of my post was for Mr. Offend. I was just trying to tell him mistakes are okay, but the idea is to try not to make them.

As for capitalizing the letter "i," there really is no point. Originally it was capitalized because in old typesets it was difficult to tell it from an "l," so they capitalized it to make it easier to read. Seeing as the typesets are quite different now, it is silly to abide by the rule.  

[_Built_to_Offend_666]

so your changing the standards to fit your personal habbits, but to others who have different habbits get the screwball?

i dont mean to sound like im starting s**t, im just trying to open the eyes to the other side of the issue.  

[zz1000zz]

_Built_to_Offend_666

so your changing the standards to fit your personal habbits, but to others who have different habbits get the screwball?

i dont mean to sound like im starting s**t, im just trying to open the eyes to the other side of the issue.

The difference between "i" and "Ppl off10 dont REliz they type lyk this when they post cus they r used 2 it" is people can easily read "i."  

[[ D i z z y ! ]]

zz1000zz

_Built_to_Offend_666

so your changing the standards to fit your personal habbits, but to others who have different habbits get the screwball?

i dont mean to sound like im starting s**t, im just trying to open the eyes to the other side of the issue.

The difference between "i" and "Ppl off10 dont REliz they type lyk this when they post cus they r used 2 it" is people can easily read "i."

Agreed.  

[_Built_to_Offend_666]

thats more of a scapegoat to justify having leniency towards your own habbits with a blind eye that other have habbits that are segregated against simply because you don't understand a problem that doesn't affect you.  

[zz1000zz]

_Built_to_Offend_666

thats more of a scapegoat to justify having leniency towards your own habbits with a blind eye that other have habbits that are segregated against simply because you don't understand a problem that doesn't affect you.

Or it could be the truth.  

[Lolita no Kitsune]

All they're really trying to say is use correct grammar. Sure, no one is perfect. We ALL make mistakes, but while typing, use what grammar you DO know about and put it to use. Don't make your typing '733t' or however they use the word 'Elete' in that fashion. You see, reading something like that fashion is hard for some people such as myself. I HATE seeing numbers in words or reading the word 'ppl' in a roleplay. It's stupid for one. And two, not everyone can read it. Sure, you don't have to capitalize all letters. That's fine. Just try and attempt to get as close to the spelling as you can and use proper prepositions and punctuation.

~_~_~Sorry to add my own 'two cents' into the conversation. I'm strong on literacy...o.o;; ~_~_~  

[Plan-Galere]

We're automatically elitists because we promote good grammar so that all who can read the english language can partake in our discussions rather than the select few or many that can decypher the jumble that some of your use as posts.
I, for one, find it much faster to type properly, and use commas and apostrophes, filling my sentances with proper language so that all know what the message contained is in it. I do, however, find it difficult to read low english, not because of a lack of intellect, but because I am used to have characters represent the proper sounds, symbols and numbers. Thusly, it would be you who discriminate, simply because while most people in this guild, if not all (I find it difficult to fathom how someone joining this guild could find it and read the description could not read english, only text talk) can read properly done english, not all can easily read other dialects of lower language.

I am not asking you to exert yourselves by pressing the "Shift" key at the start of your sentences, or occasionally in the middle of them, this merely makes it look pretty. But using proper grammar is key so that your thread can be read by anyone, ensuring that you do not descriminate against those who cannot talk "lyk dis".  

[_Built_to_Offend_666]

those who want their ideas conveyed without any confusion are going to type normally anyway. I'm just saying that not everyone has the same advantages as all of you do, so they shouldn't be held to the same standard. If people want to type in internet speak, and are willing to take the chance their message may not be understood by all, who are we to force our wills upon them?