judgement

[Z-MusicalChairMassacre-U]

I think one of the most unchristian actions in the world is judgement. She can't belive in God cause she has tattoos, he can't be a church goer he smokes, she can't believe because shes 18 and and pregnant. Those things are so...untrue! I mean in the last example I get its a sin and whatever but everyone sins, people just seem to notice others sins before their own.

In all honesty I was 19 and pregnant when I started to attend church. Since birth (Shes now 2) we've only missed like three days of church. I want a chain tattoo onmy ankle and I wanna put a line of purple in my hair. I want like four pierces on each ear.

What do you guys think? I want to do these things wheither I'm judged or not but in general I'd like some christian thoughts  

[rmcdra]

One of the lessons of the resurrection is that life goes on after being shamed. In ancient Mediaterrian culture, to be shamed was to pretty much be considered dead. The Jesus narrative countered this idea. You have God incarnated as a Jewish b*****d child. That was considered a very shameful way to be born yet Jesus continued to live and preach. Next you have Jesus dying a shameful death, publicly executed and stripped nude, yet he did not remain dead, he lives.

I don't believe any of the things you recounted are sins in and of themselves personally but if they are, life goes on. Even if society shames and considers you dead, God does not and you are alive with Christ.

I think many of us are guilty of projecting a god of our own making than sharing the God of Jesus.  

[freelance lover]

I generally try not to judge because my own personal beliefs are pretty unconventional, so I've experienced judgement before and I now how unpleasant it can be. I myself have six piercings (and I'm planning on getting my nose pierced soon), I would like a tattoo some day, support gay rights, marijuana legalization, I'll be living with my boyfriend in a few months, and I'm a religious pluralist! Those are some really hard things for some people to swallow.

I generally believe everyone has their own, unique relationship with God. They experience him differently, and so of course they will live and worship differently. I actually have a tendency to "judge" mainstream, evangelical Christians more than counter culture type people, largely because I'm afraid they won't accept me. It becomes very easy to forget to see people for people and not the stereotype they may belong to.  

[Z-MusicalChairMassacre-U]

Yea, I ean I acually strted attending church before I got pregnant mostly only to see my boyfriend who lived so far away his parents only gave hi permission to pick e up on sundays for church. However after I got pregnant chuch took on a whole other eaning to me, like I was afraid everyone there would reject me for my sin but they didn't! They even set me up teaching a sunday school class and moved me closer with another church goer so I could attend wensdays too. They stuck by me, through my baby shower and even did my wedding for free when me and my daughters father finally did decide to tie the knot. I think my church has been my closest, best family.

Hopfully they'll be okay with the changes I'm gonna make and nothing will be diffrent, thanks for the thoughts guys ^_^  

[Call Me Apple]

I do pass Judgement on people all the time. Of course I'd never speak it. People who live in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.

Am I better than them? No. But I am a human who is not flawless and makes mistakes.

I pass judgement on religious people who have tattoos & crazy body piercings yet are Jewish, Christian and Muslim. Because tattoos are against all 3 religions.

I pass judgement on girls who wear super short skirts or shorts and claim to be God fearing. If they feared God they would dress like hussies. It's mean. But I feel this is a topic which deserves honesty.

Keep in mind, 5 years ago that was me! I have tattoos, I dressed slutty. But since I became more religious i've done a 360 completely.

ALSO: We are believers in God, in an afterlife. This wordly life we live is nothing compared to the hereafter. I urge believers to live for the hereafter. Live as close to God as you can so you can have a space in Paradise.

Im not saying be Amish and live disconnected form the world. But before you do something, ask "Is this cohesive with what God wants for me?" Because I do.  

[Z-MusicalChairMassacre-U]

Yea, WWJD. I try but my excuse is I'm spanish and my temper is short (lol). Well as far as the tattoo goes now-a-days, their as removeable as the fake ones so its no longer a thing that can't be changed. The way I see it no diffrent then pierceing your ears with todays tech.

In any case I won't say more cause I'm not sure exactly which verse speaks about them so I might be missing the point completely. I do that sometimes but atleast I admit to it sweatdrop

I'm still kinda new to all of this so I think I'll have many more questions as time pasts.

@Apple - well of course, everyone mentally judges before they even think about it, their thinking what kinda person is that. I just mean judgement through actions, I knew a girl whos church banned her from attending because she had a abortion. Its not their place to judge on that and I say after something like that church is the very best place for her! Thats more of what I'm talking about. I know my church wouldn't do it to me cause of what I've already been through with them but in general...  

[Requiem Arc]

Call Me Apple

I do pass Judgement on people all the time. Of course I'd never speak it. People who live in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.

Am I better than them? No. But I am a human who is not flawless and makes mistakes.

I pass judgement on religious people who have tattoos & crazy body piercings yet are Jewish, Christian and Muslim. Because tattoos are against all 3 religions.

I pass judgement on girls who wear super short skirts or shorts and claim to be God fearing. If they feared God they would dress like hussies. It's mean. But I feel this is a topic which deserves honesty.

Keep in mind, 5 years ago that was me! I have tattoos, I dressed slutty. But since I became more religious i've done a 360 completely.

ALSO: We are believers in God, in an afterlife. This wordly life we live is nothing compared to the hereafter. I urge believers to live for the hereafter. Live as close to God as you can so you can have a space in Paradise.

Im not saying be Amish and live disconnected form the world. But before you do something, ask "Is this cohesive with what God wants for me?" Because I do.

I respect the fact that your so honest about it, though I would agree with Musicalchairs in that I wonder if you mean the initial impressions we get when we see people. In my mind its simply human to have an impression of someone when we see them, we're biologically wired that way. I define true judgement as an action, the impressions we can simply disregard and look past, but its our actions that show what we truly think. In my mind I have no right to judge in that sense.

I am curious about this tattoos thing however, as I have never heard of getting a tattoo as being a sin. I don't even see how it could be considered one. It's a form of expression and can even be considered an art in some cases. I would say that even if there is a verse in the Bible that denounces tattoos clearly (we have to remember many verses can be interpreted differently) I still don't think I would consider a tattoo a sin in and of itself. This is just my opinion however.  

[Call Me Apple]

Requiem Arc

I respect the fact that your so honest about it, though I would agree with Musicalchairs in that I wonder if you mean the initial impressions we get when we see people. In my mind its simply human to have an impression of someone when we see them, we're biologically wired that way. I define true judgement as an action, the impressions we can simply disregard and look past, but its our actions that show what we truly think. In my mind I have no right to judge in that sense.

I am curious about this tattoos thing however, as I have never heard of getting a tattoo as being a sin. I don't even see how it could be considered one. It's a form of expression and can even be considered an art in some cases. I would say that even if there is a verse in the Bible that denounces tattoos clearly (we have to remember many verses can be interpreted differently) I still don't think I would consider a tattoo a sin in and of itself. This is just my opinion however.

19:28
"You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print or tattoo any marks upon you: I am the Lord."

Tattoos are modifying God's creation and thus forbidden. At least, thats my understanding.  

[Shadows-shine]

The verses that come to my mind are "judge not lest ye be judged" and "he who is without sin, cast the first stone". Its not up to man to say who is a Christian and who is not. Only God knows the heart and doesnt judge by outward appearances. Im far from perfect and try not to judge people and try my best to follow these two verses.  

[rmcdra]

Call Me Apple

Requiem Arc

I respect the fact that your so honest about it, though I would agree with Musicalchairs in that I wonder if you mean the initial impressions we get when we see people. In my mind its simply human to have an impression of someone when we see them, we're biologically wired that way. I define true judgement as an action, the impressions we can simply disregard and look past, but its our actions that show what we truly think. In my mind I have no right to judge in that sense.

I am curious about this tattoos thing however, as I have never heard of getting a tattoo as being a sin. I don't even see how it could be considered one. It's a form of expression and can even be considered an art in some cases. I would say that even if there is a verse in the Bible that denounces tattoos clearly (we have to remember many verses can be interpreted differently) I still don't think I would consider a tattoo a sin in and of itself. This is just my opinion however.

19:28
"You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print or tattoo any marks upon you: I am the Lord."

Tattoos are modifying God's creation and thus forbidden. At least, thats my understanding.

Who's the audience in Leviticus 19

Quote:

1 The LORD said to Moses, 2 “Speak to the entire assembly of Israel and say to them: ‘Be holy because I, the LORD your God, am holy.

Also

Acts 15

10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear?

and

2 Corinthians 3

14 But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away. 15 Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. 16 But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.

Galatians 3

10 For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.”

Romans 7

4So, my brothers, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit to God. 5For when we were controlled by the sinful nature, the sinful passions aroused by the law were at work in our bodies, so that we bore fruit for death. 6But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

 

[freelance lover]

@tattoos: I've always understood the verse Apple gave to prohibit tattoos in the sense that, at the time, they were associated with pagan religions. It's the same as the dietary laws, and the special haircuts (think Hassidic Jews). God wanted the Israelites to live a life set apart from the cultures that surrounded them, so certain things that would have been part of those religions were forbidden. However, since tattoos now have no tie in with any specific religion, I don't see why they wouldn't be acceptable now. Heck, I was a tattoo of the Ichthysus.  

[Requiem Arc]

rcmdra: Thank you the detailed info, you too Apple, I appreciate it. I also think rc is making a good point, you could easily make the case that Christians are not bound to the written law of the old testament since it is the jewish Torah, or parts of it. I find that discussion very interesting for several reasons, one of which is where does that leave the ten commandments? While its true it is generally understood that we have no real reason to believe we should toss those out the door (and I'm not saying we should, far from it) I'm only saying it makes arguing any obedience to a law written before the New Testament on a textual basis incredibly difficult.  

[Zolof Keeper Of Souls]

Requiem Arc

rcmdra: Thank you the detailed info, you too Apple, I appreciate it. I also think rc is making a good point, you could easily make the case that Christians are not bound to the written law of the old testament since it is the jewish Torah, or parts of it. I find that discussion very interesting for several reasons, one of which is where does that leave the ten commandments? While its true it is generally understood that we have no real reason to believe we should toss those out the door (and I'm not saying we should, far from it) I'm only saying it makes arguing any obedience to a law written before the New Testament on a textual basis incredibly difficult.

Hmm well im pretty sure the ten commandments would be observed if you observed the two Jesus gave us. Love God with all your heart and love your neighbor as yourself. Why would you kill, or do any of the things that are forbidden by the ten commandments if you observed Jesus' two?  

[Requiem Arc]

Zolof Keeper Of Souls

Hmm well im pretty sure the ten commandments would be observed if you observed the two Jesus gave us. Love God with all your heart and love your neighbor as yourself. Why would you kill, or do any of the things that are forbidden by the ten commandments if you observed Jesus' two?

That is very true.  

[Matt Pniewski]

Judgment is best left to God and Superheroes.

Unless, of course, there is obvious wrong. I'm fed up with what I call the "Can't Judge Me" Generation. I recall being in a car with my friend Chris, his Then Boyfriend, on the way home from a gathering. At the gathering was twelve year old Girl. Chris's boyfriend, who was twenty one, spent the whole day flirting with the girl, and at the end of the day tried to convince me and Chris that we were "Being Old Fashioned" by thinking that ***** was wrong. He also made it clear that Monogamy wasn't his thing, and indicated to Chris that there was no point in being homosexual if you aren't fooling around.... Whereas Chris was expecting a committed Monogamous relationship.

Everything about this man was disgusting. I brought it up to mutual friends who insisted that I should just mind my own business, and don't judge him to harsh.

Um... How about not?

Judging is part of life. Even if it's determining fouls in a Soccer Game, deciding who is innocent or guilty in a court of law, or even deciding who you are going to date. Every part of life involves minor and major judgments. Nobody is free of this.

What a Christian ought not to do, I believe, is to administer the Judgment of God. In other words, you have no reason to claim who is or isn't hellbound. That is left for God and God alone. And maybe Fray Tormenta, if he goes to heaven.