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 Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:06 pm
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Posted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:18 pm
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Posted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:23 am
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Posted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:34 am
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ferret658 We have every right to condemn such lifestyles! Christ gave us all the power and authority to rebuke and teach!
What about those who haven't been given authority by Christ to rebuke and to teach but do so anyway? What they do is no different than what Driscoll does. It's easy to mock and rebuke when one can deflect attention away by pointing at someone else and saying "it was him, not me, who said that".
ferret658 You don't like what Driscoll has to say about women with flashy clothes and empty hearts? You don't like what he had to say about Trekkies? Did you not listen to the entire thing? Satire. It was all satire. Satire to shake people up and get them to realize that they aren't fully aligned with the Bible. Perhaps those comments struck too close to home?
I did watch and listen to the whole thing. I knew it was satire. I found it amusing. But, that's the thing: satire is veiled attack. It may be effective but it is ultimately cowardly and deceitful if meant seriously. Driscoll makes use of generalization (a device used by the church a great deal) in order to provoke specific response. He could be talking about any Trekkie. He wasn't talking about me but because I identify with liking sci-fi, I automatically make the assumption that he is talking about me and respond with shame at his judgement. That's how it works. The fact remains that no one who isn't aligned with the Bible is safe from this kind of behaviour. Replace "the Bible" with any other moral system or set of standards and it is simply a method for a person in authority to bully and badger people into line.
ferret658 Christians and non-Christians alike don't understand just how mind-blowing and controversial our God is. I was shocked and I loved every second of his sermon.
I understand how controversial prophets are. It's their business to be controversial.
ferret658 "Woe to you who spend money you don't have on stuff you don't need to impress people you don't like." How many people does that apply to? That sounds like my grandmother to me.
It applies to a lot of people -- that's the general idea.
ferret658 "No, I can't go out and find a job today, the terrorist alert level is orange." How many quotey finger men does that apply to? That sounds like me, right there, it honestly does.
Applies to me and just about everyone else who has convinced themselves they are unable to do things. Some people have a great deal of trouble convincing themselves that they can.
ferret658 Didn't that sermon convict you at all? I know I was. I was convicted deeply. Don't you understand that God pushes your buttons and hits home to get you to get up off your lazy a** and do His will? If Driscoll offended you, how much more has God offended you?
I hate it when people push my buttons for any reason, as a rule. The fact that people do it in God's name for me to do what they claim is God's will does it moreso. |
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Posted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:36 am
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Posted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 1:03 am
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ferret658 semiremis I'm of the opinion that you have no right to condemn the rich unless you are living a life like that of the Franciscan friars. I didn't like how he singled out the women for the first 15 minutes or so either, he also gets negative points for leaving the Catholic Church. I also didn't like the comments on the Trekkie's. On the positive side he's not sitting back and just accepting the fluffy Christian rhetoric which is so prevalent at least in the US today and so contradictory to what you find in the bible. He's a good speaker for the most part. We have every right to condemn such lifestyles! Christ gave us all the power and authority to rebuke and teach! You don't like what Driscoll has to say about women with flashy clothes and empty hearts? You don't like what he had to say about Trekkies? Did you not listen to the entire thing? Satire. It was all satire. Satire to shake people up and get them to realize that they aren't fully aligned with the Bible. Perhaps those comments struck too close to home? Christians and non-Christians alike don't understand just how mind-blowing and controversial our God is. I was shocked and I loved every second of his sermon. "Woe to you who spend money you don't have on stuff you don't need to impress people you don't like." How many people does that apply to? That sounds like my grandmother to me. "No, I can't go out and find a job today, the terrorist alert level is orange." How many quotey finger men does that apply to? That sounds like me, right there, it honestly does. Didn't that sermon convict you at all? I know I was. I was convicted deeply. Don't you understand that God pushes your buttons and hits home to get you to get up off your lazy a** and do His will? If Driscoll offended you, how much more has God offended you?
I'm really sorry for being so coarse. It's been pointed out to me that I have such tendencies....
I know it's not an excuse, but I've been having a tough time with my life right now. Once again, I'm really sorry if I upset you. |
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Posted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:29 am
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Posted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:07 pm
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ferret658 semiremis I'm of the opinion that you have no right to condemn the rich unless you are living a life like that of the Franciscan friars. I didn't like how he singled out the women for the first 15 minutes or so either, he also gets negative points for leaving the Catholic Church. I also didn't like the comments on the Trekkie's. On the positive side he's not sitting back and just accepting the fluffy Christian rhetoric which is so prevalent at least in the US today and so contradictory to what you find in the bible. He's a good speaker for the most part. We have every right to condemn such lifestyles! Christ gave us all the power and authority to rebuke and teach!
No we do not have every right, the bible warns against it for those judging others before they take a good look at themselves and that's what I had meant in my other post. Besides, Christ did not give us all the power and authority to rebuke teach and I'd like to know where in the bible you think it says otherwise.
Matthew 7:1-5 Judge not, that you may not be judged. 2 For with what judgment you judge, you shall be judged: and with what measure you mete, it shall be measured to you again. 3 And why do you see the mote that is in your brother's eye; and see not the beam that is in your own eye? 4 Or how do you say to your brother: Let me cast the mote out of your eye; and behold a beam is in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of your own eye, and then shall you see to cast out the mote out of your brother's eye.
Quote: You don't like what Driscoll has to say about women with flashy clothes and empty hearts? You don't like what he had to say about Trekkies? Did you not listen to the entire thing? Satire. It was all satire. Satire to shake people up and get them to realize that they aren't fully aligned with the Bible. Perhaps those comments struck too close to home?
They struck very close to home but not because of what was being said but because of how much emphasis he placed on women, I get just as weary with those who concentrate all of their efforts on homosexuals. We all sin and long story short it came across to me as sexist, I watched most of it and a great majority of the speech was about the faults of women and I had to ask my self why? I know know different sermons tackle different issues and I guess it could have been just a tiny part of a larger speech?
Why are you making so many assumptions about me though? Is it so difficult to simply ask me to elaborate on what I said earlier?
Quote: Christians and non-Christians alike don't understand just how mind-blowing and controversial our God is. I was shocked and I loved every second of his sermon.
I agree that many Christians seem to forget much of the bible and the knowable attributes of God but I can't say that I was shocked by what he said or that I loved every second of it.
Quote: "Woe to you who spend money you don't have on stuff you don't need to impress people you don't like." How many people does that apply to? That sounds like my grandmother to me.
No here is where I was getting at with living like a Franciscan friar before speaking on the riches of others and the misuse of their own wealth. I don't know how much you know about them but they give a vow of poverty, they live to serve God and his people completely. If anyone has any right to say anything at all to others on this matter then it's people like those friars because they have abandoned that aspect of the world. You have to ask your self, do you live comfortably, should you live comfortable when there are people who are still literally starving to death in the world? You see, many people like to pick on the really wealthy and they in turn are blind to how comfortable and well off they themselves are. I talk to God about this often, I think about it often. I'm sitting in a heated house, typing on a computer. I have all the food I need but what about those who don't? Complaining about the rich people out there isn't going to take away from the fact that I can do more, we all can. Driscoll was wearing a nice watch, he had on some fine clothes and personally I find it difficult to listen to him drag on about the wealthy woman in fine clothes with all her riches when I have no reason to believe any different of him. Different degrees of wealth are just different degrees.
It's like with Jesus telling the man without sin to cast the first stone, and no one threw a rock. Did you notice that Jesus didn't either? Do you remember what he said?
John 8:10-11 10 Then Jesus lifting up himself, said to her: Woman, where are they that accused you? Has no man condemned you? 11 Who said: No man, Lord. And Jesus said: Neither will I condemn you. Go, and now sin no more.
Jesus could have condemned her, why didn't he?
Quote: "No, I can't go out and find a job today, the terrorist alert level is orange." How many quotey finger men does that apply to? That sounds like me, right there, it honestly does. Didn't that sermon convict you at all? I know I was. I was convicted deeply.
It seemed a bit misguided to me. |
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Posted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:32 pm
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Posted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 3:26 pm
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ferret658 ferret658 semiremis I'm of the opinion that you have no right to condemn the rich unless you are living a life like that of the Franciscan friars. I didn't like how he singled out the women for the first 15 minutes or so either, he also gets negative points for leaving the Catholic Church. I also didn't like the comments on the Trekkie's. On the positive side he's not sitting back and just accepting the fluffy Christian rhetoric which is so prevalent at least in the US today and so contradictory to what you find in the bible. He's a good speaker for the most part. We have every right to condemn such lifestyles! Christ gave us all the power and authority to rebuke and teach! You don't like what Driscoll has to say about women with flashy clothes and empty hearts? You don't like what he had to say about Trekkies? Did you not listen to the entire thing? Satire. It was all satire. Satire to shake people up and get them to realize that they aren't fully aligned with the Bible. Perhaps those comments struck too close to home? Christians and non-Christians alike don't understand just how mind-blowing and controversial our God is. I was shocked and I loved every second of his sermon. "Woe to you who spend money you don't have on stuff you don't need to impress people you don't like." How many people does that apply to? That sounds like my grandmother to me. "No, I can't go out and find a job today, the terrorist alert level is orange." How many quotey finger men does that apply to? That sounds like me, right there, it honestly does. Didn't that sermon convict you at all? I know I was. I was convicted deeply. Don't you understand that God pushes your buttons and hits home to get you to get up off your lazy a** and do His will? If Driscoll offended you, how much more has God offended you? I'm really sorry for being so coarse. It's been pointed out to me that I have such tendencies.... I know it's not an excuse, but I've been having a tough time with my life right now. Once again, I'm really sorry if I upset you.
Thanks for the apology, I didn't really get offended but I appreciate it nonetheless.
I hope things turn around soon for you. |
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Posted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 9:04 pm
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Semiremis No we do not have every right, the bible warns against it for those judging others before they take a good look at themselves and that's what I had meant in my other post. Besides, Christ did not give us all the power and authority to rebuke teach and I'd like to know where in the bible you think it says otherwise.
I know it's in there somewhere because my youth leader quotes it all the time. Let me call her tomorrow and ask her because I can't find it right now. I will get back to you with an answer, though.
Quote: They struck very close to home but not because of what was being said but because of how much emphasis he placed on women, I get just as weary with those who concentrate all of their efforts on homosexuals. We all sin and long story short it came across to me as sexist, I watched most of it and a great majority of the speech was about the faults of women and I had to ask my self why? I know know different sermons tackle different issues and I guess it could have been just a tiny part of a larger speech?
Why are you making so many assumptions about me though? Is it so difficult to simply ask me to elaborate on what I said earlier?
I was in a bad mood....Sorry....
Quote: It's like with Jesus telling the man without sin to cast the first stone, and no one threw a rock. Did you notice that Jesus didn't either? Do you remember what he said?
John 8:10-11 10 Then Jesus lifting up himself, said to her: Woman, where are they that accused you? Has no man condemned you? 11 Who said: No man, Lord. And Jesus said: Neither will I condemn you. Go, and now sin no more.
Jesus could have condemned her, why didn't he?
John 3:17 "For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him." |
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Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:22 am
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Semiremis Priestley Semiremis [H]e also gets negative points for leaving the Catholic Church.
If you're talking about the Catholic Church as the institution with the Pope at head of it then, no, that is not the church as laid out by Jesus and the disciples. Why leaving such an institution would give him negative points isn't clear, hence my confusion at your statement and asking you to explain why.
Nevertheless, it's not important. It's a comment that seemed strange in context. |
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Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 3:57 pm
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Priestley Semiremis Priestley Semiremis [H]e also gets negative points for leaving the Catholic Church.
Nevertheless, it's not important. It's a comment that seemed strange in context.
The Catholic Church was laid out by God therefore leaving that Church gets him negative points. The premise is backed by the bible and it's found in the vast majority of early Christian literature, Pauline Christian to be specific.
The logic is clear but I don't think I'm going out on a limb here in assuming you take issue with the premise? |
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