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 Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 1:03 am
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Okay, i have been away for a long time from this place, I've never really posted but just read what was said and going around trying to figure things out for myself.
but I've come across some cross roads that need to be taken and i have no clue where to go. i have doubts and worry's about somethings and questions of my mental health.
this is really hard for me, mainly because the one who taught/told me about this and the information was someone who i loved and respected but found out years latter after giving my heart to her that she was a lier and a deceiver who loved manipulating people and confusing them.
so here it goes:
1. i've had a second name for myself since i was a small child, i thought that it was just something that i made up that i would want my name to be. after role-playing in my back yard using that name she had told me that i was her reincarnated sister/guardian (BTW she was claiming to be a vampire duchess from France.)
well i started to beleave her on the reincarnation and i started to pretend to come out as my reincarnated self to make her happy. but then i started to get flashes of some things that she would say about and so i started to really beleave her. the thing that really solifiyed it was when we found who she claimed to be her daughter and i started to get powerful memories ones i knew that weren't my own. (her 'daughter' is pretty much in the same boat as i'm in at this point.)
the other thing that gets me worried is that the one who was a lier told me that i was a important person before i was even her guardian and that i was an eciclapidia of knolige and wisdom. sometimes i say things that i feel are true but i'm not positive, i'm not sure if its just BS or not and i try to refrain from mentioning any specifics but its gotten me into some trouble. (one of the reasons why i joined is because Deoridhe had helped me on the many mistakes i made on a paganism paper i did and then tried to post for a friend to read as well.)
2. my veiw's of the god and the goddess i think has gotten confused with some of my own imagination. i've been writing a story for many years that involve a god and a goddess and i started to call them by the names of those characters, and starting to beleave some of the mythology that i've created for them. i'm not sure if i should continue to call them by those names or not.
3. during my years with the one who lie's she told me about the ability to also hold other spirits within our own. i personaly disbeleaved her claim to over 300 spirits resideing within her own. (it would make a person crazy, even if all of them were 'asleep' as she had told me)
well just as i pretend to be my reincarnation i also pretended to have spirits as well, but then it felt like there was one within me, and then it felt like others may have as well. oviously i was confused and scared and turned to the only expert i knew, and she fuled that these are spirits and was happy that i was like her, a spirit bearer, or as she latter called us, Alts.
eventualy the one's that were fake was pushed into the background and i started to think, what if these ones are truly spirits, one's that come to reside along with me to help me on my journy on earth. i had narowed it down to three (one, me relizing, i was makeing up just for an excuse of haveing a vampire as well.)
i'm not sure anymore if the two i have are real or not, they are peaceful (one's a child and the other is a creature of some sort that meditates almost all the time) but if they are my guides or they are just figments i have no clue, but it eats at me constantly.
4. as i mentioned i call the god and goddess by name's i created and thus i've been actualy quite scared about trying to even find a path for me to fallow, i beleave in a goddess and a god, i also respect those other god's and goddess as those that are equal to those two. and are children out of a single source. i've resurched egyption when i was a child, and i've some knolige of greek and roman mythology as well as Asatru and Japanese Shinto mythology. (i probibly be considering prusueing Shugendo if it wasent for that they forbit women to be on the sacred mountains.)
(i sencery apologize to all those that don't want to hear the winneing and complaining of anothers problems.)
well, for now this is it, i've expressed more here than i've EVER expressed to anyone in real life
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Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 2:47 am
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chrissy_of_hailfire Okay, i have been away for a long time from this place, I've never really posted but just read what was said and going around trying to figure things out for myself.
Well, that's a good start. Looking to ones own self before turning to others is useful, as the ability to self-examine is critical, naturally one needs to also have the capability to be honest with one-self.
chrissy_of_hailfire but I've come across some cross roads that need to be taken and i have no clue where to go. i have doubts and worry's about somethings and questions of my mental health.
Yes, concern for ones own mental health and well-being is vital. Also being able to be sceptical of ones own experiences is important as well, as far as I am concerned, as this shows that you are still able to operate in midgard rather than living your daily life in the otherworlds.
chrissy_of_hailfire this is really hard for me, mainly because the one who taught/told me about this and the information was someone who i loved and respected but found out years latter after giving my heart to her that she was a lier and a deceiver who loved manipulating people and confusing them.
The hardest is when we fall for people, as often the techniques we employ to filter out deception tend to be pushed to the back of ones repertoire of operands, and we are more willing to believe what we are told, for we consider that someone whom loves us could never deceive us, and yet, time and again, such is shown to be false. Many times relationships involve at least a small amount of deception to begin with, we hide our 'bad habits' and such from others and always put our best foot forward to impress the other party, but invariably, as familiarity comes into the picture, we become less and less guarded about such things, and often these can be points for contention. Hence it's quite normal for the pattern of behaviour that you've described, or at least it is from my experience to date.
chrissy_of_hailfire 1. i've had a second name for myself since i was a small child, i thought that it was just something that i made up that i would want my name to be. after role-playing in my back yard using that name she had told me that i was her reincarnated sister/guardian (BTW she was claiming to be a vampire duchess from France.)
To be honest, that should have set off alarm bells to start with. Anyone whom claims to be a vampire in the classical sense of the matter, whether reincarnated or not, is pretty much living in a fantasy world. The desire to be something unusual or different, and indeed, cool, is invariably the motivation, but in my experiences, those whom claim vampirism, for the most part, are simply self-delusional people whom use such to mask their manipulative natures.
What is your opinion on your second name? Now that you've gained perspective on this individual, what are your feelings about the second name? Note: ignore how you feel about the other person, that's just 'stuff'. What you need to concentrate on is the name itself and whether or not it is sufficiently congruent that you are able to still identify with it. Your own internal barometer on the matter is very important. Warning: telling people about your other names, or such, lends them power; most know the concept of the True Name, well, I'm less into that, what I'm specifically addressing is that when you tell someone another name, they'll instantly know that name means something to you, and so if they wish to manipulate you, for what-ever reason, you've just given them great ammunition to do so. What you're much better off doing is being non-specific, so, tell the person you've got another name, but let them figure it out. If they are as good as they say they are, then they should be able to pick up on it. If not, then they are a charlatain. And be careful of giving them too much information with which they can build background. I know this all sounds very cloak and dagger, but the simple fact of the matter is, you need to be very careful with things like this, as you have discovered.
chrissy_of_hailfire well i started to beleave her on the reincarnation and i started to pretend to come out as my reincarnated self to make her happy. but then i started to get flashes of some things that she would say about and so i started to really beleave her. the thing that really solifiyed it was when we found who she claimed to be her daughter and i started to get powerful memories ones i knew that weren't my own. (her 'daughter' is pretty much in the same boat as i'm in at this point.)
Okay, we have a couple of concepts which I'm going to address here from my ancestral perspective. The first is the Fylgia. Now, this is an entity, generally seen as an animal, although it can manifest as a being of the opposite sex of the holder (usually), which accompanies us throughout our lives, and records everything that we do. Now, they have done this for previous generations in our family lines too. So, the Fylgia contains a store of all the experiences of each person that the Fylgia has been attached to, which means that sometimes, a person can gain 'past life memories' from the Fylgia. Now this means that those past life memories, are in fact of someone else, but you can access them through the Fylgia.
The next is the Well of Urdr. This can be seen to be the equivalent of the Theosophic concept of Akashic Record. To explain the concept of the Well of Urdr, and Orlog, one needs to think about the concept of that every action, by every thing, ends up becoming a part of 'that which is'. Think of it this way, water is in the well, it gets drawn up by the trees roots (yggdrassil), then transpires in the leaves, which then condenses to water again, dripping into the well, and so the cycle continues. Each drop can be considered an action, which has a particle of earth in it (think condensation nuclei), these particles of earth, are layed down in layers (like sediment), and as layers go deeper and deeper, they are harder to change. Recent sediment can be stirred up easily, but older sediment, turns to mud, and yet older sediment turns to clay, and finally rock. These are the Ur layers (ur = ancient/old), lag can mean both law, and something layed down, so urlag = orlog. So, everything that's ever happened, is in this well. If one is able to do so, one can look into the well, and see anything that has ever happened. Great one might say, but it's harder to peer into the Well than one might think and few achieve it to a great extent where they can zero in on anything that's in there. But, it's another reason why one can possibly tune into a 'past life', as one might be tuning into a life, which is entirely unrelated to any of our ancestors, or us, for that matter. A person whom is cunning enough, can nudge us in the right direction to look at what they wish to be seen.
So, one might say that I don't believe in re-incarnation as it's often expressed by the 'new age' community, and you'd be right. The ideas often espoused are too feeble and childish to be given creedence, as they avoid the hard stuff, the possibility that you might pick up on something else, or someone else. It's my opinion, that it's why so many claim to have been someone famous in a past life, because even if they pick up on things which are not widely known, they can just be tuning into that life that was led, and may not be related to that person in any way, shape or form.
Hence it's important to consider such things when dealing with past life experience.
chrissy_of_hailfire the other thing that gets me worried is that the one who was a lier told me that i was a important person before i was even her guardian and that i was an eciclapidia of knolige and wisdom. sometimes i say things that i feel are true but i'm not positive, i'm not sure if its just BS or not and i try to refrain from mentioning any specifics but its gotten me into some trouble. (one of the reasons why i joined is because Deoridhe had helped me on the many mistakes i made on a paganism paper i did and then tried to post for a friend to read as well.)
Well, you can see, that if you've got the ability to look into Urds Well, then yes, you'd be an encyclopaedia of Knowledge and Wisdom smile Actually, mentioning specifics is a good thing. Why? Well, it's good from the point of being able to identify whether or not the information you're getting is congruent with what other think and believe. If you're the only person getting the information and it cannot be found anywhere else, then it's probably a good idea to be sceptical of the information. Now, it may be right, but it may be wrong, so you can turn around and state that it's opinion and that nothing either supports or denies it. However, if you come up with something, which can be proven to be false, then you've got to be able to turn around and accept that it may indeed be false.
chrissy_of_hailfire 2. my veiw's of the god and the goddess i think has gotten confused with some of my own imagination. i've been writing a story for many years that involve a god and a goddess and i started to call them by the names of those characters, and starting to beleave some of the mythology that i've created for them. i'm not sure if i should continue to call them by those names or not.
Not unusual, as to be honest THE 'god' and THE 'goddess' are made up characters. They've been taken from different belief systems, and co-opted into a singularity which has never actually existed. Most of the 'evidence' that those whom wish to infer that there was once A 'goddess' for all of humanity, can be very quickly and easily taken apart. The work of Maria Gimbutas and her co-horts and supporters is a good example of very poor research, designed to pursue proving a particular socio-political agenda. I'm loathe to use such an example, due it it's contriversial nature, but it has very bad parallels in the search for the Aryan Ubermenschen performed in the 1930's and earlier.
To be honest, what you name the 'god' and 'goddess' based on the above, means that it's entirely immaterial. The 'god' and 'goddess' exist in a Jungian format as expressions of a collective unconscious (or in this case, a collective conscious) which chooses for them to exist. It is entirely within the realm of possibility that gods and goddesses are created and forgotten almost daily. It's only the ones that gain popularity that really continue onwards. It may sound rather fluffy a concept, but the creation of deities by human beings does occur, and indeed, it's one of the reasons that eclecticism works, in my personal opinion. Whether or not the god or goddess that you're calling upon exists or not, if you believe they exist, then they do, regardless of whom, or what they are in reality.
Now, that said, certain gods and goddesses have longevity on their side. They've been around for a long time, and have particular characteristics and personalities, much like we do, but these are reinforced over many centuries, and as such, they gain a certain 'weight'. Just look at the Egyptian gods and goddesses, especially Ra and Horus. The confusion in the Germanic Folkways of Frigg and Freyja, whom we can prove with relative certainty that they are separate goddesses, but still people ask the question.
chrissy_of_hailfire 3. during my years with the one who lie's she told me about the ability to also hold other spirits within our own. i personaly disbeleaved her claim to over 300 spirits resideing within her own. (it would make a person crazy, even if all of them were 'asleep' as she had told me)
If a person has that many spirits inside them, then they are probably long gone. That is, their core personality is so well and truly beaten to a pulp, that it's cowering in some dark recess of their mind, and what-ever is at the controls from time to time is what's doing the talking. Schizophrenia in some cases is this. Be careful to assign all Schizophrenic cases to possession though, as some cases are caused by clinical physiological symptoms, or through trauma.
Be very careful too, sometimes people can say they've got spirits inside them, when all they are is really good actors.
How can you tell, well, the only real proof is through experience, and learning the persons behavioural patterns. A good one, is that if a person has a particular anchored response, say to a song, or a tone of voice, or a particular touch, if when they are in their 'possessed' state, that anchored response can be elicited, then they are not actually possessed, but merely acting, for it will interrupt the pattern of behaviour. If however, it fails to interrupt the pattern of behaviour, then it's more possible that they're MPD or, dare one say it, possessed.
chrissy_of_hailfire well just as i pretend to be my reincarnation i also pretended to have spirits as well, but then it felt like there was one within me, and then it felt like others may have as well. oviously i was confused and scared and turned to the only expert i knew, and she fuled that these are spirits and was happy that i was like her, a spirit bearer, or as she latter called us, Alts.
Nothing like feeling special smile Do you like Henry Rollins? Ever heard his song Liar smile You might want to take a listen, I'm sure it's on Youtube.
chrissy_of_hailfire eventualy the one's that were fake was pushed into the background and i started to think, what if these ones are truly spirits, one's that come to reside along with me to help me on my journy on earth. i had narowed it down to three (one, me relizing, i was makeing up just for an excuse of haveing a vampire as well.)
Okay, well, personally, acting as a vessel for spirits, is a dangerous thing. Spirits usually live in the otherworlds, and will interact with you if you can sense them and work with them. It's a respect thing. To have a spirit that's riding around with you, specifically internally, is something to be concerned about. Now, if they're attached to you, like the Fylgia I mentioned above, that's a different thing. They tend to manifest externally, and whilst they go around with you, it's markedly different to them being inside you.
chrissy_of_hailfire i'm not sure anymore if the two i have are real or not, they are peaceful (one's a child and the other is a creature of some sort that meditates almost all the time) but if they are my guides or they are just figments i have no clue, but it eats at me constantly.
Okay, well, if they are guides, what are they guiding you in? What advice do they give? Where's the evidence that they are guids and beneficial? smile See, the thing we really need to do is to critically think about such things. Blind faith, is just that. And if it's eating at you, well, ask the questions above, and what answers you receive within your own mind will give you the information you're seeking.
chrissy_of_hailfire 4. as i mentioned i call the god and goddess by name's i created and thus i've been actualy quite scared about trying to even find a path for me to fallow, i beleave in a goddess and a god, i also respect those other god's and goddess as those that are equal to those two. and are children out of a single source. i've resurched egyption when i was a child, and i've some knolige of greek and roman mythology as well as Asatru and Japanese Shinto mythology. (i probibly be considering prusueing Shugendo if it wasent for that they forbit women to be on the sacred mountains.)
What's your ancestry? Start there.
chrissy_of_hailfire (i sencery apologize to all those that don't want to hear the winneing and complaining of anothers problems.)
Heh, I thought that's part of what this Guild was for smile
chrissy_of_hailfire well, for now this is it, i've expressed more here than i've EVER expressed to anyone in real life
And yes, it's a good thing to get such things off your chest...
Ver thu heil |
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Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 10:59 am
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In addition to the wonderful points Ulfrikr makes:
chrissy_of_hailfire ~snip Vampire Reincarnation stuff~
Welcome to the wonderful world of Mr. Darks.
Quote: 2. my veiw's of the god and the goddess i think has gotten confused with some of my own imagination. i've been writing a story for many years that involve a god and a goddess and i started to call them by the names of those characters, and starting to beleave some of the mythology that i've created for them. i'm not sure if i should continue to call them by those names or not.
I see a few options in this.
1) It's completely made up and has no spiritual value at all.
2) You've created some nifty deity shaped thought forms.
3) There are individual deities that have contacted you and given you their mythos (in my personal opinion, this is the least likely- but not impossible)
So what does that leave you with? Ask them and then test to see if they are telling the truth.
Quote: 3. during my years with the one who lie's she told me about the ability to also hold other spirits within our own...
As Ulfrikr points out- holding spirits within one's body can be dangerous without correct training and proper safety measures.
Quote: 4. i probibly be considering prusueing Shugendo if it wasent for that they forbit women to be on the sacred mountains.
confused
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Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 10:56 pm
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Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Well, that's a good start. Looking to ones own self before turning to others is useful, as the ability to self-examine is critical, naturally one needs to also have the capability to be honest with one-self.
well, i try to be as honest with myself as possible, and it's hard to be honest with yourself when your confused and not sure what to do.
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Yes, concern for ones own mental health and well-being is vital. Also being able to be skeptical of ones own experiences is important as well, as far as I am concerned, as this shows that you are still able to operate in midgard rather than living your daily life in the otherworlds.
ok, little confused on the definition of "midgard"
as as for being skeptical, after she who lie's i'm unfortunately skeptical about all of my spiritual experiances from that time. some were truely benificial of breaking from my LDS (AKA mormon) mold. (just to note, i have nothing against the LDS church and i value their help on many occasions with helping me with my spiritual dissisions)
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn The hardest is when we fall for people, as often the techniques we employ to filter out deception tend to be pushed to the back of ones repertoire of operands, and we are more willing to believe what we are told, for we consider that someone whom loves us could never deceive us, and yet, time and again, such is shown to be false. Many times relationships involve at least a small amount of deception to begin with, we hide our 'bad habits' and such from others and always put our best foot forward to impress the other party, but invariably, as familiarity comes into the picture, we become less and less guarded about such things, and often these can be points for contention. Hence it's quite normal for the pattern of behaviour that you've described, or at least it is from my experience to date.
what brought me to realize her deception is her inconsistency with her tales and her 'memory' of what had happened. that and plus everyone that she first met was a friend, but as soon as they were no longer a friend they were an enimey and had been so before they were friends.
thus foolishly scared of having her wrath, i stayed friends (i had on multiple times tried to break the friendship off, but because of my soft heart and not having the strongest resolution would end up withdrawing the comment or letter or talk. i had to end up doing it the cowards way and do it by phone.)
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn To be honest, that should have set off alarm bells to start with. Anyone whom claims to be a vampire in the classical sense of the matter, whether reincarnated or not, is pretty much living in a fantasy world. The desire to be something unusual or different, and indeed, cool, is invariably the motivation, but in my experiences, those whom claim vampirism, for the most part, are simply self-delusional people whom use such to mask their manipulative natures.
this is something that i'm VERY aware of now, and thus those that claim Vampire origen i give a bottle of salt with their story.
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn What is your opinion on your second name?
as for my opinion of my name, well it was not made up by her so i know that it's one of the things that i can count on that is true. biggrin
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Now that you've gained perspective on this individual, what are your feelings about the second name? Note: ignore how you feel about the other person, that's just 'stuff'. What you need to concentrate on is the name itself and whether or not it is sufficiently congruent that you are able to still identify with it. Your own internal barometer on the matter is very important.
i'm still able to identify with it mainly because i feel that it is still my own name still. i dont feel like it was defiled or anything by the imaginings that she had put to my name. but, i am unsure about it exactly i'm not sure if it will still be mine or not as practically everyone i had met while with her used my name. i'm unsure if it's still sacred, or if it is still able to be aplyed to me anymore or not.
basically, what that all said was i feel that its mine, but i still have some misgivings that it might not be mine anymore.
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Warning: telling people about your other names, or such, lends them power; most know the concept of the True Name, well, I'm less into that, what I'm specifically addressing is that when you tell someone another name, they'll instantly know that name means something to you, and so if they wish to manipulate you, for what-ever reason, you've just given them great ammunition to do so. What you're much better off doing is being non-specific, so, tell the person you've got another name, but let them figure it out. If they are as good as they say they are, then they should be able to pick up on it. If not, then they are a charlatain. And be careful of giving them too much information with which they can build background. I know this all sounds very cloak and dagger, but the simple fact of the matter is, you need to be very careful with things like this, as you have discovered.
as for the warning about revealing my second name, i've fortuantely know enough to not reveal about it as it's a sacred/private thing and that it's not to be revealed lightly. unfortunately i did not know that at the time.
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Okay, we have a couple of concepts which I'm going to address here from my ancestral perspective. The first is the Fylgia. Now, this is an entity, generally seen as an animal, although it can manifest as a being of the opposite sex of the holder (usually), which accompanies us throughout our lives, and records everything that we do. Now, they have done this for previous generations in our family lines too. So, the Fylgia contains a store of all the experiences of each person that the Fylgia has been attached to, which means that sometimes, a person can gain 'past life memories' from the Fylgia. Now this means that those past life memories, are in fact of someone else, but you can access them through the Fylgia.
ok, well, this is something that i had put in the back of my mind as i just wrote it off as a fantasy. (and as i'm now just plain o' tiered of keeping it secret i'm just going to give her name. it's alot easyer on me and on you all as well.)
While i was liveing with Brytny for awhile. (AKA she who lie's) i started to see a shadow image of a man, just a very faint shadow that was simular to a paper cut-out. it would appear during the day and the night.
at first i dismissed it as to my imagination or to the weed i would smoke (NOTE!!!!!!! I DO NOT DO THAT ANY MORE!!!!!!!!)
anyways, it slowly formed a shape and it looked like one of my chracters from the story that i mentioned. the character was suposed to be my other half. (a yin and yang thing) so i disbelieved it.
i had told brytny about it and she said that he was my personal ghost. well, at this point i was beginning to doubt her but this made sense as he would follow me around. (for some VERY strange reason he liked to appear in the bathroom and would sit on the sink. after he would do that a few times i told him that he was not allowed in the bathroom EVER AGAIN)
well then came the time that i thought he was speaking to me, and that broke the reality straw for me. i decided that it was just the weed and i ignored him. just before i left brytny's house he had 'told me' that he was going to Europe and i never saw him since.
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn The next is the Well of Urdr. This can be seen to be the equivalent of the Theosophic concept of Akashic Record. To explain the concept of the Well of Urdr, and Orlog, one needs to think about the concept of that every action, by every thing, ends up becoming a part of 'that which is'. Think of it this way, water is in the well, it gets drawn up by the trees roots (yggdrassil), then transpires in the leaves, which then condenses to water again, dripping into the well, and so the cycle continues. Each drop can be considered an action, which has a particle of earth in it (think condensation nuclei), these particles of earth, are layed down in layers (like sediment), and as layers go deeper and deeper, they are harder to change. Recent sediment can be stirred up easily, but older sediment, turns to mud, and yet older sediment turns to clay, and finally rock. These are the Ur layers (ur = ancient/old), lag can mean both law, and something layed down, so urlag = orlog. So, everything that's ever happened, is in this well. If one is able to do so, one can look into the well, and see anything that has ever happened. Great one might say, but it's harder to peer into the Well than one might think and few achieve it to a great extent where they can zero in on anything that's in there. But, it's another reason why one can possibly tune into a 'past life', as one might be tuning into a life, which is entirely unrelated to any of our ancestors, or us, for that matter. A person whom is cunning enough, can nudge us in the right direction to look at what they wish to be seen.
this is the first time that i've heard this, i would like to know more information. i would like to know if i am doing this subcontionsly or not or if it is a natural talent that people have. please let me know so that i could weigh the options of this posibility.
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn So, one might say that I don't believe in re-incarnation as it's often expressed by the 'new age' community, and you'd be right. The ideas often espoused are too feeble and childish to be given creedence, as they avoid the hard stuff, the possibility that you might pick up on something else, or someone else. It's my opinion, that it's why so many claim to have been someone famous in a past life, because even if they pick up on things which are not widely known, they can just be tuning into that life that was led, and may not be related to that person in any way, shape or form. Hence it's important to consider such things when dealing with past life experience.
on this i tried febily to resurch the people that she claimed to be and prove her falsehood to her face and/or to see if my past life was true or not. but because of her inconsistency i eventually gave up, i knew that she was false.
but i still wonder about if it was a true past life. if it is, then it is. if it is not, then it is not.
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Well, you can see, that if you've got the ability to look into Urds Well, then yes, you'd be an encyclopaedia of Knowledge and Wisdom smile Actually, mentioning specifics is a good thing. Why? Well, it's good from the point of being able to identify whether or not the information you're getting is congruent with what other think and believe. If you're the only person getting the information and it cannot be found anywhere else, then it's probably a good idea to be sceptical of the information. Now, it may be right, but it may be wrong, so you can turn around and state that it's opinion and that nothing either supports or denies it. However, if you come up with something, which can be proven to be false, then you've got to be able to turn around and accept that it may indeed be false.
well, as i've said i've tried to refrain from giving knowledge that i'm unsure of, least i misdirect someone. but it has been a bad habit of mine to just say my opinions as a fact, and thus just getting myself to say this is my opinion is hard for me. (but i'm working on trying to say: this is what i think, or something of that nature)
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Not unusual, as to be honest THE 'god' and THE 'goddess' are made up characters. They've been taken from different belief systems, and co-opted into a singularity which has never actually existed. Most of the 'evidence' that those whom wish to infer that there was once A 'goddess' for all of humanity, can be very quickly and easily taken apart. The work of Maria Gimbutas and her co-horts and supporters is a good example of very poor research, designed to pursue proving a particular socio-political agenda. I'm loathe to use such an example, due it it's contriversial nature, but it has very bad parallels in the search for the Aryan Ubermenschen performed in the 1930's and earlier. To be honest, what you name the 'god' and 'goddess' based on the above, means that it's entirely immaterial. The 'god' and 'goddess' exist in a Jungian format as expressions of a collective unconscious (or in this case, a collective conscious) which chooses for them to exist. It is entirely within the realm of possibility that gods and goddesses are created and forgotten almost daily. It's only the ones that gain popularity that really continue onwards. It may sound rather fluffy a concept, but the creation of deities by human beings does occur, and indeed, it's one of the reasons that eclecticism works, in my personal opinion. Whether or not the god or goddess that you're calling upon exists or not, if you believe they exist, then they do, regardless of whom, or what they are in reality. Now, that said, certain gods and goddesses have longevity on their side. They've been around for a long time, and have particular characteristics and personalities, much like we do, but these are reinforced over many centuries, and as such, they gain a certain 'weight'. Just look at the Egyptian gods and goddesses, especially Ra and Horus. The confusion in the Germanic Folkways of Frigg and Freyja, whom we can prove with relative certainty that they are separate goddesses, but still people ask the question.
I’ve known of people that do have their own name’s for the god and the goddess but one of the things that mainly get to me is the mythos that I’ve created about them that I will discuss below.
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn If a person has that many spirits inside them, then they are probably long gone. That is, their core personality is so well and truly beaten to a pulp, that it's cowering in some dark recess of their mind, and what-ever is at the controls from time to time is what's doing the talking. Schizophrenia in some cases is this. Be careful to assign all Schizophrenic cases to possession though, as some cases are caused by clinical physiological symptoms, or through trauma. Be very careful too, sometimes people can say they've got spirits inside them, when all they are is really good actors. How can you tell, well, the only real proof is through experience, and learning the persons behavioural patterns. A good one, is that if a person has a particular anchored response, say to a song, or a tone of voice, or a particular touch, if when they are in their 'possessed' state, that anchored response can be elicited, then they are not actually possessed, but merely acting, for it will interrupt the pattern of behaviour. If however, it fails to interrupt the pattern of behaviour, then it's more possible that they're MPD or, dare one say it, possessed.
ok, I’m confused when you say MPD. And I’ve never heard of Schizophrenic before. Thank you for that information.
One fact that might help you to understand why I origionaly beleaved her was that I latter found out that she was bipolor (or at least she claimed to be, but she did fit the symptoms of the drastic up and down moods.)
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Nothing like feeling special smile Do you like Henry Rollins? Ever heard his song Liar smile You might want to take a listen, I'm sure it's on Youtube.
I’m not much into music but I will check him out if it would help me understand.
And yes I know that was a HUGE mistake now, but as I only knew of her, and that their might be a possibility of her having an actual spirit but just making up the others to feel even more important. (as like the vampire wasen’t enough for her.)
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Okay, well, personally, acting as a vessel for spirits, is a dangerous thing. Spirits usually live in the otherworlds, and will interact with you if you can sense them and work with them. It's a respect thing. To have a spirit that's riding around with you, specifically internally, is something to be concerned about. Now, if they're attached to you, like the Fylgia I mentioned above, that's a different thing. They tend to manifest externally, and whilst they go around with you, it's markedly different to them being inside you.
yes one of the dangerious ones (I’m fairly shure that she was fake) was a serial killer suposidly, and I was fortunate enough to kick her out of my mindscape. I’ve since (I hope) built walls/shealds to prevent anyothers from entering my mindscape.
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Okay, well, if they are guides, what are they guiding you in? What advice do they give? Where's the evidence that they are guids and beneficial? smile See, the thing we really need to do is to critically think about such things. Blind faith, is just that. And if it's eating at you, well, ask the questions above, and what answers you receive within your own mind will give you the information you're seeking.
as I said I have two, one a child and the other…. A goat type thingie (obviously I was hesitant at mentioning her. She looks quite like a light brown fured human but with a goat-like head and legs. Oh and she dosent have mammary glands at all. She also dosent have a tail. I’ve drawn a picture of her but, my hardrive cant connect to the computer that I’m using.
She’s the one that usually give’s me the advice. She’ll just give me a nudge when I’m indecisive about something. Like when I was debateing with myself weither or not to post she told me: “what harm would it do to ask, you want to know something right? Maybe their opinions would help you” and as she would usually do she would go back into her room and start meditating again.
My second one as I said is a small child. Personally I have great doubts about this one. I’m not sure if she is a figment of my imagination to attempt to continue my childhood, or if she truly is a spirit that needs a safe harbor.
I’ve had one powerful experience with her, it was in someone’s car and they were playing a song that had some drumming in it. Suddenly the child’s memory (or maybe my own, I have no clue,) came up and I was within a round room, similar to a grain storage. The doors were being banged on, as some people were trying to come in. it terifyed me as I felt her fear.
It’s the only time that I’ve had something like that before. I’ve never had memorys with goat-chick (the name I gave her before she FINALY gave me her name)
chrissy_of_hailfire 4. as i mentioned i call the god and goddess by name's i created and thus i've been actualy quite scared about trying to even find a path for me to fallow, i beleave in a goddess and a god, i also respect those other god's and goddess as those that are equal to those two. and are children out of a single source. i've resurched egyption when i was a child, and i've some knolige of greek and roman mythology as well as Asatru and Japanese Shinto mythology. (i probibly be considering prusueing Shugendo if it wasent for that they forbit women to be on the sacred mountains.)
ok, here goes me trying to explain everything about the god and the goddess that I’ve made up for my story.
Once their was nothing but Fuder Gray (taken from some language, looked a dictionary for it) but then fuder gray. Awakend his sleeping children, and tought him all that he knew. The first of those was Lehot and Deara (aka light and dark)
The children having been taught all that Fuder Gray knew went out to create their worlds. Now being full gods and goddess, Lehot and Deara could not touch each other or come too close as their union would create chaos. (yin and yang concept 1) but soon they grew to the point that they could not stay far from each other anymore and went to embrace each other in love. (aka. Combining spirits)
But at the last moment when the melding was almost complete they had a split second of indecision and separated quickly, but they found that they separated in the others body. (yin and yang concept 2)
Enraged, and confused being both light and dark they had to take the responsibility of the other. Thus taking different names for themselves Darkra, and Athena (Darkra is obviously for Dark, and Athena is the goddess of war and crafts, peace and war. (It was an interesting concept for me.)
This is the short version. I wont even go into the Arnthicks (or Arnticks, haven’t decided exactly what the name is)
Ulfrikr inn Hrafn
What's your ancestry? Start there.
[/quote]
well, my mother’s side would be the best as I know nothing about my father.
Suposidly the reason why my mother was so scared when I came out of the broom closet was because she had apparently messed around with witchcraft and had gotten possessed. My grandfather had to give her a blessing in order for it to releace her.
This is one of the reasons why I’m kinda scared, I know for a fact that she would never lie to me in order to keep me in the church, so I can trust that this actually happened. (I also plan on asking my grandparents about this incident discreatly so I can get more information on what happen.) but I mainly know that she was untrained and was using a Junk book. May those books burn. (that’s saying a lot for a certified book worm)
But back to the topic (sorry) I’m French, Irish, and Welish. The majorities being in that order. I’ve attempted to look into Diana and Druid, but I believe all the information was Fluffy biased.
[quote="Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Heh, I thought that's part of what this Guild was for smile
ya, but you get this a lot, so someone has to apologize razz |
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Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 11:09 pm
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Ok finaly to the second person…
TeaDidikai In addition to the wonderful points Ulfrikr makes: chrissy_of_hailfire ~snip Vampire Reincarnation stuff~ Welcome to the wonderful world of Mr. Darks.
thank you for the link, VERY inciteful. Another note to mention was that Brytny was literally dripping with negative energy constantly and I would ALWAYS feel drained around her. That was one of the reasons why at first I thought she truly was a Phy Vampire, because of the drain of my emotions and energy when I was around her. I latter found out that she was just so full of negative thoughts that she just pulled everyone down under.
TeaDidikai I see a few options in this. 1) It's completely made up and has no spiritual value at all. 2) You've created some nifty deity shaped thought forms. 3) There are individual deities that have contacted you and given you their mythos (in my personal opinion, this is the least likely- but not impossible) So what does that leave you with? Ask them and then test to see if they are telling the truth.
Well the problem is that they actually have never communicated to me. (ya I know it dosent prevent me from asking them, and I HAVE, but I don’t get any response that I can see in my life)
of the options you gave any are possible. and all are likely. (personaly though the last would be scary for me)
TeaDidikai As Ulfrikr points out- holding spirits within one's body can be dangerous without correct training and proper safety measures.
I know, I’ve relized that and it’s one of the reasons why I’ve come for advice on this. If they are real or not that is.
TeaDidikai Are you Japanese? Last I checked Shugendo was more or less outlawed and the next best thing is Shinto which is not an open religion. confused
razz no I’m not, I’ve studied Shugendo for an anime school that I was the history teacher (and latter principal). One of the characters was a Shugendo preiast and I fell in love with the saving the world type of thing. (got that from the Mr. Dark. smile lol)
I liked the way that they just decided they wanted parts of Shinto, Buddhism and Taoism and just made their own religion. (I’ll try and find the links that I found for THAT research paper)
BTW it was outlawed in the Ming Dynasty but there is some revival of it nowadays.
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Posted: Mon Oct 08, 2007 2:24 am
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chrissy_of_hailfire BTW it was outlawed in the Ming Dynasty but there is some revival of it nowadays.
Okay, I can't really read through the rest of this because, to be completely honest, I can't slog through all the grammar and spelling errors, but since this was at the very end, I noticed it, and as an east asian studies major, I am forced to point out that the Ming Dynasty is Chinese, and thus a poor indicator of when shugendou was outlawed in Japan, especially considering that the Ming dynasty was from the 1300s to the 1600s, during which time Japan went through a handful of very turbulent periods where the government did a loopty-loop several times over.
Furthermore, shugendou was actually banned long after the Ming period ended. Even if you wanted to use a comparative Chinese dynasty to refer to the outlawing of shudendou, you'd be looking to reference the tail end of the Qing Dynasty, which is a lot more complicated than just saying "the beginning of the Meiji restoration," which automatically puts us in the late 1800s (whereas the Qing dynasty ranges from the mid-1600s all the way to the revolution in 1911).
Okay, geek moment over. |
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Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:24 am
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Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 1:04 pm
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Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 4:09 pm
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chrissy_of_hailfire i do apologize but from the sources i've read, the shugendo religion was wiped out in the 1800's and the book i read mentioned the mijin dynasty.
Meiji, not Mijin, and Japanese historical eras are not dynasties, they are periods. Chinese historical eras are called Dynasties because they change any time the imperial family, or dynasty, changes. Japan has an unbroken imperial line - the only thing that ever changed was who had military control of the country - so Japan does not have dynasties. Because the emperor was both the spiritual and national leader, the militaristic forces that took down the nobles' ruling class status during the wars that brought the Heian period to its end didn't hurt the emperor, they just stripped him of his power to rule. This is why the US letter to Japan demanding its opening to the West was addressed to the shogun, not the emperor - by that point, the emperor was there for religious and nationalistic purposes, not to rule. How much attention did you really pay to that book you read?
The Meiji Restoration, or the Meiji period, marked the restoration of Emperor Meiji to the throne as a ruling power, and the dissolution of the samurai class, who by then had become both morally and quite literally bankrupt. The ban on shugendou, like many other changes Meiji made, was done in an effort to eradicate what was seen as the superstition and backwardness of the past and bring Japan into the 19th and 20th centuries as a modern, powerful, industrialized nation.
Shugendou was not eradicated, however, it just melded into various esoteric Buddhist sects that were protected as a state religion. Now that it's no longer an issue, groups who want to splinter off into "shugendou" proper are doing so, while others are pretty happy staying in esoteric Buddhism, which honestly isn't all that different (at least on a surface level - not being an initiate of any sect of esoteric Buddhism OR shugendou, I can only go on material made public by the groups' respective authorities).
Quote: i'm sorry if i was wrong though, i did not try to be an expert on the subject and most of the reasurch was done online.
You may not've tried to be an expert on the subject, but everything you said about shugendou was pretty much wrong. You didn't phrase it as "I read somewhere that..." You phrased it as a fact - even an offhand sort of "oh by the way" fact. Which means someone who doesn't know any better would think that's right, when in fact it's all wrong.
This also goes to show that internet research is pretty crap if you really wanna know about something, although honestly, if you can't even remember the word Meiji, you're probably not really THAT interested - at least not in doing the hard work and research involved. Doing a google search doesn't really count as far as I'm concerned.
If you're actually serious about studying shugendou - and that's a very big if because even if you are, what Tea says is right (even basic Japanese culture is hugely insular, so you'd have a hard enough time trying to be a Shintoist, much less something more obscure and more insular) - please, please, please take at least one college-level class on the history of Japan. And please, please, please pay attention to everything you're taught and memorize as much as you can.
Clearly, you have a very shallow understanding of shugendou and of Japanese culture and history. And that's okay, it really is, because it's easy to get a shallow understanding from watching anime and just getting pop culture bits and pieces - Japan is very careful about what it exports to the masses, just as it's very careful about what it imports from us. You can always study more. But the fact is, you can't be considered as "pursuing shugendou" if you don't know much about it except what the internet tells you - which could be anything, because there is no fact/bullshit filter on websites that'll tell you what's right and what's wrong on a given page.
You could be considered as having a vague, passing interest in something like shugendou, that's about it. So if you're REALLY interested, go find actual people who know about Japan and have them teach you as much as they can. Ideally, you should also learn Japanese and then read Japanese-language documents BY actual shugendou practitioners. Then you should travel to Japan, find these people, and respectfully, politely try to get them to teach you. It probably won't work, but if you're informed, and earnest, and a hard worker, and you actually bother doing the research, and understand Japanese culture and how you should act within its confines, who knows, you may get adopted in someday. You cannot separate shugendou, or any Japanese religion really, from its cultural and historical context - you can't know shugendou without knowing where it, and its practitioners, come from. So even just knowing the word Meiji and remembering it correctly, that would be a good first step.
Or you could take the easy way out, and just play Dungeons & Dragons far east adventures, and play a shugenja spellcaster there. That's open to anyone with no work required (well, except writing out your character sheet). |
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Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 1:10 pm
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Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 1:37 pm
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Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 5:30 am
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Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 6:25 am
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Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:02 am
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patch99329 Ulfrikr inn Hrafn Heilsan Allir, I'll reply to this as time permits smile But does anyone know why the formatting is screwy or is it just my browser? Ver thu heil Having the exact same problem neutral |
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Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 10:05 am
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Reply
