So, I saw my counceler today... Gifted?

[AS574]

She said the intelligence test said I'm gifted. That's why I've had so much trouble fitting in with people my age.

My question is:

Is it possible I'm goth not because that's who I am but, because I was just trying to fit in with a crowd that was odd [no offense to anyone] like me?  

[Rellik San]

Could just be you like the style and music... thats always an option, if you wanted to be an outsider, you could've gone metal, grunge, rock, hippy or any of those other fringe groups, you didn't, you made a conscious choice to be goth whether you realise it or not.  

[Henneth Annun]

Rellik San

Could just be you like the style and music... thats always an option, if you wanted to be an outsider, you could've gone metal, grunge, rock, hippy or any of those other fringe groups, you didn't, you made a conscious choice to be goth whether you realise it or not.

It might not have been entirely consious, but that doesn't matter. Something about this culture must have attracted you, something that other cultures didn't have. If goth is just "who you are" as you say, then it's natural you were atracted to it. Maybe you were looking for an odd crowd, and you just happened to fit in with us sweetie!  

[AS574]

XWraith_LordX

Rellik San

Could just be you like the style and music... thats always an option, if you wanted to be an outsider, you could've gone metal, grunge, rock, hippy or any of those other fringe groups, you didn't, you made a conscious choice to be goth whether you realise it or not.

It might not have been entirely consious, but that doesn't matter. Something about this culture must have attracted you, something that other cultures didn't have. If goth is just "who you are" as you say, then it's natural you were atracted to it. Maybe you were looking for an odd crowd, and you just happened to fit in with us sweetie!

Both of you have wonderful insight. You really settled my worries.  

[Madonna Wayne Gracy]

The gifted are just as abnormal as the retarded and very similar is ways.  

[Rellik San]

Sarah the Tree

The gifted are just as abnormal as the retarded and very similar is ways.

Well thats true, after all people with downs syndrome are considered to be extremely intelligent, but are snubbed from the higher echelon organisations like mensa because they aren't able properly articulate their ideas.

There is also that famous thing, of the more intelligent you become, the harder it is for people to understand you.  

[Isobel Bellamy]

Rellik San

Sarah the Tree

The gifted are just as abnormal as the retarded and very similar is ways.

Well thats true, after all people with downs syndrome are considered to be extremely intelligent, but are snubbed from the higher echelon organisations like mensa because they aren't able properly articulate their ideas.

There is also that famous thing, of the more intelligent you become, the harder it is for people to understand you.

Mensa is just an organisation for "intelligensia" to ponce around thinking they're so much more intelligent than others because they can be measured in an IQ test highly.
IQ tests are not objective, they're subjective, they only tell you how well you do in IQ tests, not how intelligent you are.

They don't measure musical genius, nor artistic genius, or any other type of non-intellectual genius. Would you not call Rachmaninov, Beethoven or Mozart geniuses? What if they scored low on IQ tests? Same with the likes of Raphael, Bottcelli, Michelangelo?

Enough mensa and iq bashing. I now remove my soapbox from your thread *appologies*


But, if you do test high on them, it does show you will generally do well academically, and so could very well have a bright future.

Taking a tangent (back on topic), I've seen many-a-alternative person taking university physics degrees, tehre seems to a correlation with being 'gifted'/intelligent and prefering the fringe subcultures, probably something in that.  

[DreamerSpirit]

Isobel Bellamy

Taking a tangent (back on topic), I've seen many-a-alternative person taking university physics degrees, tehre seems to a correlation with being 'gifted'/intelligent and prefering the fringe subcultures, probably something in that.

On that topic, I've noticed on a couple other gothic forums which I'm a member of, the discussion seems to be more intelligent that that of your average forum, and a high percentage of its members have college degrees, or are working on getting such degrees. However, that could also be due to the median age on these forums (most of thier members are at least 23, with many members being in thier 30's or older).


On the topic of intelligence and fringe subcultures, I've noticed that of my school's intellectual elite, a high percentage are sort of 'outcasts', even if they're not interested in any subcultures. I'm actually of above average intelligence, and am taking several AP courses this year, and finding them to be not very difficult.  

[Rellik San]

You know what makes me laugh, this thing of children being smarter then the average adult now... it sounds amazing at first, but then consider it, children these days have access to resources most adults could only have dreamed of, such as high speed internet, multiple channels devoted to documentaries and high end PC's that can run advanced theoretical applications.

Now smarts are apparently genetic, so imagine the parents had these tools also, would the kids seem so smart if their education and tools for education was on par with their parents... I doubt it some how.

Of course this could just be the British thing of complaining.... "ohhh more and more people are getting top marks in A-Levels... rather then patting them on the back for working hard, we must make the tests harder."  

[zz1000zz]

Rellik San

You know what makes me laugh, this thing of children being smarter then the average adult now... it sounds amazing at first, but then consider it, children these days have access to resources most adults could only have dreamed of, such as high speed internet, multiple channels devoted to documentaries and high end PC's that can run advanced theoretical applications.

Now smarts are apparently genetic, so imagine the parents had these tools also, would the kids seem so smart if their education and tools for education was on par with their parents... I doubt it some how.

I must first question the idea that intelligence is genetic. For such a common claim, there is little or nothing to support it.

Second, i am baffled what having an internet connection could possibly have to do with intelligence. A person with access to an encyclopedia has no advantage over a person without one when it comes to intelligence. More resources can encourage the development of intelligence, but it in no way begets it.

I find it disturbing to hear "children are smarter than adults," as that just seems to be an excuse and a lie.  

[Rellik San]

zz1000zz

Rellik San

You know what makes me laugh, this thing of children being smarter then the average adult now... it sounds amazing at first, but then consider it, children these days have access to resources most adults could only have dreamed of, such as high speed internet, multiple channels devoted to documentaries and high end PC's that can run advanced theoretical applications.

Now smarts are apparently genetic, so imagine the parents had these tools also, would the kids seem so smart if their education and tools for education was on par with their parents... I doubt it some how.

I must first question the idea that intelligence is genetic. For such a common claim, there is little or nothing to support it.

Second, i am baffled what having an internet connection could possibly have to do with intelligence. A person with access to an encyclopedia has no advantage over a person without one when it comes to intelligence. More resources can encourage the development of intelligence, but it in no way begets it.

I find it disturbing to hear "children are smarter than adults," as that just seems to be an excuse and a lie.

Hence first, why I said 'supposedly' because little research has been done into this.

I also maintain that education thusly intelligence, at the least on an academic level, has been made easier by the advent of advanced communication networks which offer more collected knowledge then any library in more languages then any international conference. Lets face it, intelligence in an academic regard is largely effected by the environment the person has around them. Which circles me round to my original point, that the world at large today equips children with advantages most people over the age of 20 never had.

Then tell that to the television executives that run shows like "Are you smarter then a 10 year old?" and "Is your child a genius?" (actual shows here in the UK).  

[zz1000zz]

Rellik San

intelligence in an academic regard

I lost interest right here. We are talking about different topics. I was referring to actual intelligence, whereas you are referring to that narrow-minded, blinder-wearing bull society touts as intelligence to avoid having to think.

It is all in the semantics.  

[Disease of the Flesh]

Well you have to know most goths are smarter then other people. I also see that on my school. Just normal alternative people have a lower education then me and 3 other goths at my school, who are doing the highest education possible(to get to university). So I just think you are goth for a reason maybe even. I am also gifted and also didn't fit in.

My first 12 school years I didn't have any real friends and just loved to be alone, till I met some nice people in the alternative section of our school. That was also the time I realized what I really was, a goth. I used to deny it. Till I was 15 1/2. That makes me a really late goth. But I have been listening to goth music since I was 10, was interested in goth clothing and I had a kind of morbid fascination(I used to tie up naked barbies, and make them bleed with tomato ketchup. When I was 7/8/9 ) of which I didn't realize I had it till I was 14.